yeahh this ones quite similar to that "Ultimate Archer" thing but it's a bit different... and unfortunately an elf... It doesn't actually matter what order you take most of these feats in.. i just kept forgetting about some and took them in the middle

Race : Elf
Alignment : Any lawful

STR 14
DEX 18
CON 10
INT 12
WIS 14
CHA 8

Level (1-40)

1. Monk : Discipline 4, Heal 4, Listen 4, Parry 4, Tumble 4, Point Blank Shot
2. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1
3. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1, Weapon focus - Longbow
4. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1, Dexterity +1
5. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1
6. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1, Dodge
7. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1
8. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1, Dexterity +1
9. Monk : Discipline 1, Heal 1, Listen 1, Parry 1, Tumble 1, Ambidexterity
10. Wizard : Suggested Spells - Mage Armor, Protection From Alignment, True Strike
11. Arcane Archer : Heal 2, Listen 2
12. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Dexterity +1, Improved Critical : Longbow
13. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
14. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
15. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Two Weapon Fighting
16. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Dexterity +1
17. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
18. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Improved Two Weapon Fighting
19. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
20. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Dexterity +1
21. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Epic Weapon Focus - Longbow
22. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
23. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
24. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Armor Skin, Great Dexterity I, Dexterity +1
25. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
26. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
27. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Weapon Focus - Kama
28. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Great Dexterity II
29. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
30. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Epic Weapon Focus - Kama
31. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
32. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Great Dexterity III, Dexterity +1
33. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Epic Prowess
34. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
35. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1
36. Arcane Archer : Listen 1, Great Dexterity IV, Weapon Finesse
37. Monk : Listen 1, Tumble 28, Listen 28, Parry 28
38. Arcane Archer : Heal 3, Listen 1
39. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Epic Skill Focus - Parry
40. Arcane Archer : Heal 1, Listen 1, Open Lock 1, Disable Trap 1

Final Stats :

STR 14
DEX 32
CON 10
INT 12
WIS 14
CHA 8

Naked Stats :
AC - 35
AB (Unarmed) - 38/35/32/29/26/23
AB (With 1 Kama) - 41/38/35/32/29/26
AB (With 2 Kama's) - :39/39/36/36/33/30/27/24
AB (With Longbow) - 55/50/45/40, +15 Damage
Fortitude - 23
Reflex - 34
Will - 23

Skills :
Parry - 61
Tumble - 51
Listen - 47
Heal - 45
Discipline - 42

Pro's :
High Parry - even higher with maxed dex and some items. Will evade most blows on Parry and hit back on quite a few.
High AC - If you can max your wisdom and Dex, as well as get your hands on +5 gear and Haste, Can have 72 AC
High AB - Can use bow to almost always hit, and Kama's still have a decent AB to them
True Strike - Not long lasting, but enough to hit almost anyone
Speed - You get to run a bit faster.. yay!

Con's :
Low Fort and Will saves
No resistance to energies or spells
A lot of servers have a butload of peircing resist items
He's an elf, they smell bad


Yeahhh you can post suggestions ... Or you can get some pie.. i suggest the pie but it's up to you I got only one suggestion - take weap finesse earlier (swap this with dodge maybe?) unless you plan on using only a bow, and no melee until lvl 36. haha, thats why i said it doesnt matter much what order you take feats in except all epic AA feats are Great Dex i think..
I was at level 30 something and was like "crap i forgot weapon finesse!".. no biggie Whats your damage per hit? Thats always my concern with AA builds. So many look great but you take them 'outside' where you have DR items ect and all you see in a bunch of golden zeros poping up. Any Barb, DD or Epic DR feat Char with a good 10DR belt will just laugh and ignore you till all your friends are dead.

However, I love the speed, AC and AB; all great. Now if only you can hurt them.... Maybe arrows with some positve energy or other odd damage (Sonic ect...) well i posted above the damage with bow.. its +15
Kama just +2, unless you max your STR then its +8
Most servers will have a bow with +5 mighty though, you dont do AS much as you would if you were STR based using normal weapons but, its still a good amount.
Way i see it, as far as archers go, its pretty good 1. With 29AA levels why do you ever want to melee? Take this away and you can dispense with the useless Parry skill and save on feats too.

2. For AA damage you want a composite bow with the Mighty attribute. This suggests a boost in STR would be beneficial.

3. With a Monk/AA I wonder whether boosting Wisdom and taking the Zen Archery feat wouldn't be more apposite. You would have a handy name then too (e.g. Ultimate Zen Archer). Gives you decent Will saves too.

4. Do you really need all those skill points in Heal? Hide/Move Silently could have some benefits.

5. When taking the Wizard level take 10 points in Spellcraft to add +2 to saves against spells.

6. 10 levels of Monk is not optimal, maybe one less early on and a second Wiz at level 20 (boosting Spellcraft) might be better.
Quote: Posted 10/30/04 11:03:16 (GMT) -- Thorsson64

1. With 29AA levels why do you ever want to melee? Take this away and you can dispense with the useless Parry skill and save on feats too.

2. For AA damage you want a composite bow with the Mighty attribute. This suggests a boost in STR would be beneficial.

3. With a Monk/AA I wonder whether boosting Wisdom and taking the Zen Archery feat wouldn't be more apposite. You would have a handy name then too (e.g. Ultimate Zen Archer). Gives you decent Will saves too.

4. Do you really need all those skill points in Heal? Hide/Move Silently could have some benefits.

5. When taking the Wizard level take 10 points in Spellcraft to add +2 to saves against spells.

6. 10 levels of Monk is not optimal, maybe one less early on and a second Wiz at level 20 (boosting Spellcraft) might be better.

heh ok.. in response to :

1. Took melee because a lot of servers have items with 15-30 peircing resist. Also, bow only gets 4 attacks / round, whereas dual Kama's will get you 11 or 12

2. I have STR to 14 so if i find a bow with mighty, I'll be able to boost it (cause almost any server with Composite bows will have STR boost items)

3. You could chose Zen Archery i suppose, its basically a trade for Will instead of Reflex, although personally i prefer the Reflex

4. I base this under some assumtions, and one being that your going to need heal skill to heal yourself better (Healing kits, some servers have special healing items you need heal skill to use certain times / day, etc.)

5. You could take the Spellcraft if you want, its all your choice on what skills you want really, those are just my suggestions for them

6. To start taking AA levels you HAVE to have 9 monk 1 wiz. 1st level wizard doesn't get a BaB. So if you chose the Wizard in the higher levels, you'd get bonus spellcraft sure, but you'd also lose 7 AC (6 from tumble, 1 from being 10th level monk)
Quote: Posted 10/30/04 17:37:25 (GMT) -- Tilbono

1. Took melee because a lot of servers have items with 15-30 peircing resist. Also, bow only gets 4 attacks / round, whereas dual Kama's will get you 11 or 12

2. I have STR to 14 so if i find a bow with mighty, I'll be able to boost it (cause almost any server with Composite bows will have STR boost items)

3. You could chose Zen Archery i suppose, its basically a trade for Will instead of Reflex, although personally i prefer the Reflex

4. I base this under some assumtions, and one being that your going to need heal skill to heal yourself better (Healing kits, some servers have special healing items you need heal skill to use certain times / day, etc.)

5. You could take the Spellcraft if you want, its all your choice on what skills you want really, those are just my suggestions for them

6. To start taking AA levels you HAVE to have 9 monk 1 wiz. 1st level wizard doesn't get a BaB. So if you chose the Wizard in the higher levels, you'd get bonus spellcraft sure, but you'd also lose 7 AC (6 from tumble, 1 from being 10th level monk)

1. Loads of Kama attacks, but low AB and low damage means that this isn't going to save your bacon if the bow don't work... And slashing resistance is more common than piercing.

2. Agreed on a medium to high magic world your STR will be sufficient.

3. AA get's good reflex and fort saves anyway, so the boost to will has a point.

4. Heal kits are needed on low magic worlds. So in relation to your answer on point 2, you can't have it both ways...

5. Spellcraft is the magic equivalent of tumble. It's clearly a better skill on most PWs. Of course you can take a less useful skill if you want...

6. OK. This is a problem with the generic build. I'd never suggest not taking the last level of Monk in the last few levels.

The true ultimate archer is the Bard/RDD/AA, but I'll deal with that in another thread. "4. Heal kits are needed on low magic worlds. So in relation to your answer on point 2, you can't have it both ways..."
The str is high enough for IF a server has the composite bow, not assuming they will. its basically for weight but if therse composites its a perk

As for the Kamas... i suppose it depends where you play, but generally not everyone has high AC. For instance you could be fighting someone that could smack the crap outta you but has low AC (meaning tank fighters lol). Which is when I'd use a Kamas, and possibly Parry.

As for spellcraft vs. Tumble, its all a matter of what you want i guess, personally i prefer the 6 AC over the 6 throws. No, no. I'm not suggesting for a moment that you don't max tumble. You just misread my post. You have to take a further level of Monk at the end. The question really is should you stop there or take another 3 levels and get SR, immunity to poison and an extra attack on your flurry (at a cost of +1 to attack with bow), or take another level of Wiz and max your Spellcraft and get an extra spell (at no cost as far as I can see). heh, for me.. unless im making pure monk, i dont even bother building magic defences really. All mages tend to use would be Isaacs Greater Missile Storm, which has no save . No save, but SR works (unfortunately each missile has to be resisted individually).

Still, no AA build has a chance against an IGMS spamming arcane caster regardless. With empowered and maximised as well and Epic MA and Warding, it's only possible for other spellcasters to beat such a character.

Equally almost any build will kick Monster ***.

The question therefore is: Is the build "maximised" - using these classes can you do better, or is there another class that could substitute successfully for one of these? I think that it's clear that substituting the last level of AA for one of Wizard brings an improvement to the build in any world where you get potions of Heal/CCW/CSW. In a world where you don't get these, then it's likely that the build will lack in strength = damage.

The ability to parry with kamas appears to add no strength to the build - it does nothing against spellcasters or AA builds, or monk builds. Or rogue based builds either. Or DD builds with a high DR. Even against STR melee builds, on low magic worlds you'll get killed by dev crit, and on medium magic worlds the kamas will never do any damage.

Have you actually tried the build out in PvP? yeah i have.. it hasnt lost to another PvP build yet, whether i use Kamas or Bow.. Mages on the other hand would kick my arse How do you get 11 attacks per round? I thought you could get 9 with flurry and 10 with haste. Have you considered substituting rogue for monk? yes you lose the wisdom ac bonus, but you gain use magic device, uncanny dodge, and if you take 10 rogue levels a rogue special feat.

on a build like that you can drop wis to a solid 12 and take great will and luck of heroes as feats, giving you a +3 will save and +2 to fort and reflex, and giving you something to do with two pre epic feats that often end up being used for buggy, debatably useful things like blind fight (sure it SEEMS like a good idea...)

if you build for a server with no GOOD dex boost items, I do recommend starting at 20 dex, and shooting for the full 40 dex at 40th..the extra BAB comes in handy when you cant find enough items to get the full +12 dex buff NWN allows.

Also, on a server where you can get the full +12 ride, that puts you squarely to 52 (FIFTY TWO) dexterity at level 40 with items..

With a build of 10 rogue levels, which grants you dodge, mobility, evasion, improved evasion, uncanny dodge and a rogue only feat such as defensive roll, there is very very little out there that can seriously hurt you as long as you stay out of melee...but as an archer you have no business getting into melee anyway.

Another good base is the much ignored bard. just 3 levels of bard, (level 6 for 10 dodge, 10 spellcraft and 10 UMD, level 21 for 25 dodge, spellcraft and UMD, and level 40 for 43 dodge, 43 spellcraft and 40 UMD)along with barbarian (yah..barbarian) levels will make the loss of the monk AC bonus meaningless.

And a full 40 UMD means you can use ALL scrolls with zero failure and 99% of items out there including class and race restricted items.

Give it a shot and post back what you think of those alternatives..your build has some good potential whether you go 38 total dex or 40.

As to the piercing resistance issue..heh dont forget all the arrow types out there, not to mention the bows with extra damage of non-piercing types...and never forget that unlimited arcane scroll use means access to spell breaches, spell mantles, globes, and stat reducing effects, PLUS a full selection of divine scrolls once you hit 40 UMD.

Edited By Elanthil Seldavius on 05/12/05 12:22