Playable from level 1 - 40 .PvM

Race:human
str 13
dex 8
con 13
int 10
wis 16
cha 15

1 Pal weapon focus, toughness
2 Pal
3 Pal extra turning
4 pal +1 wis
5 cler magic, trickery
6 cler combat casting
7 cler
8 cler +1 wis
9 cler maximize spell
10 cler
11 cler
12 cler +1 wis, improved crit
13 cler
14 cler
15 cler extend spell
16 cler +1 wis
17 cler
18 cler spell penetration
19 cler
20 cler +1 wis
21 cler epic weapon focus
22 cler
23 cler
24 cler +1 wis, improved combat casting
25 cot
26 cot armor skin
27 cot greater spell penetration
28 cot +1 wis, epic spell penetration
29 cot
30 cot epic prowess, great strength I
31 cot
32 cot +1 wis, great wisdom I
33 cot great strength II
34 cot great wisdom II
35 cler
36 cler +1 wis, epic spell: hellball
37 cler great wisdom III
38 cler
39 cler great strength III
40 cler +1 str, great wisdom IV

final stats:
str 17
dex 8
con 13
int 10
wis 29
cha 15

ok, so this is the build I posted it here, cause I'm searchin for some improvements, feel free to post your opinions

Edited By Kail Pendragon on 10/12/07 15:23

Quote: Posted 07/07/05 17:32:46 (GMT) -- jedi1

final stats:
str 17
dex 8
con 13
int 10
wis 29
cha 15

There's a better way to do this. Start with a 14 Charisma, and raise your Con and Str to 14 each. You've ended every important stat on an odd number. While buffs and items can even that out, I would seek a more streamlined and eficient stat spread.

I would also then take Wisdom for an even 30 and leave ending Str at 16. You'd get an extra 6th level casting. I would even consider going to 32 Wisdom for an additional 7th level casting.

I would also free yourself from the burden of Hellball, and take something more defensive, like Epic Warding.
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Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
Quote: Posted 07/07/05 17:55:09 (GMT) -- grizzled_dwarflord

Quote: Posted 07/07/05 17:32:46 (GMT) -- jedi1

final stats:
str 17
dex 8
con 13
int 10
wis 29
cha 15

There's a better way to do this. Start with a 14 Charisma, and raise your Con and Str to 14 each. You've ended every important stat on an odd number. While buffs and items can even that out, I would seek a more streamlined and eficient stat spread.

I would also then take Wisdom for an even 30 and leave ending Str at 16. You'd get an extra 6th level casting. I would even consider going to 32 Wisdom for an additional 7th level casting.

I would also free yourself from the burden of Hellball, and take something more defensive, like Epic Warding.

Excellent advice Grizz, but Clerics don't get Epic Warding.
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It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!! Oops, forgot about that small detail. In that case, might I suggest Greater Ruin?
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Ariel, Ookla, RIDE! is greater ruin really better than hellball??

Quote: While buffs and items can even that out, I would seek a more streamlined and eficient stat spread.

what do you mean by this?
Quote: Posted 07/07/05 19:38:52 (GMT) -- jedi1

is greater ruin really better than hellball??

Quote: While buffs and items can even that out, I would seek a more streamlined and eficient stat spread.

what do you mean by this?

He means you don't get any increase in benefits from having odd-numbered stats. You can raise them with items and/or buffs to even them out, but since the max stat boost possible is +12, that would leave you on an odd number if you maxed the stat boost, which is a waste of points.

Example: your build has 17 STR. If you cast Bull's STR, you'll get +2 to +5 points in STR added to that. Assume you get the max of +5. That puts your STR at 22. Very nice. Now let's assume you get a combination of buffs and items that raise STR by +12 (the maximum possible). Suddenly your STR is topped out at 29, which is no better than 28, so basically, you have a 'wasted' STR point. It's more efficient to end your stats on an even number if at all possible.
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It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!! I like paladin/cot builds and I like clerics, so this is a build that I like. But I wouldn't post if that is all I had to say. I think I would take 12 levels of CoT pre-epic for the AB (or as many as you can within build parameters. If being level 26 cleric matters to you, take 8 CoT levels pre-epic.). A level 17 cleric gets level 9 spells. If you went Cleric 18/CoT 18, you'd get two bonus feats from the CoT (of course, you'd lose your Cleric bonus feats) and you'd have +4 to all saves while still having level 9 spells (no epic, though). I am not necessarily recommending that, but you do have to play around with the numbers, level it up and see what it does. For example, Cleric 22/Cot 14 gets you the CoT bonus feat, +2 to all saves, and level 9 spells and epic spells, depending on when you took the cleric levels.

Cheers.
Quote: Posted 07/11/05 15:59:16 (GMT) -- Ithacan

I think I would take 12 levels of CoT pre-epic for the AB (or as many as you can within build parameters.

Firstly, CoT is a prestige class and as such you can only take 10 lvls of it pre-epic. Secondly, it looks to me like all the feats taken in epic levels are epic feats, so for every two levels of CoT moved pre-epic you would have to drop an epic feat and select a weaker one instead.
Quote: Posted 07/11/05 16:21:10 (GMT) -- pulse cap

Quote: Posted 07/11/05 15:59:16 (GMT) -- Ithacan

I think I would take 12 levels of CoT pre-epic for the AB (or as many as you can within build parameters.

Firstly, CoT is a prestige class and as such you can only take 10 lvls of it pre-epic.

Doh!

You are exactly right. I guess you balance AB v. what you need your feats to be.
Quote: Posted 07/11/05 15:59:16 (GMT) -- Ithacan

I like paladin/cot builds and I like clerics, so this is a build that I like. But I wouldn't post if that is all I had to say. I think I would take 12 levels of CoT pre-epic for the AB (or as many as you can within build parameters. If being level 26 cleric matters to you, take 8 CoT levels pre-epic.). A level 17 cleric gets level 9 spells. If you went Cleric 18/CoT 18, you'd get two bonus feats from the CoT (of course, you'd lose your Cleric bonus feats) and you'd have +4 to all saves while still having level 9 spells (no epic, though). I am not necessarily recommending that, but you do have to play around with the numbers, level it up and see what it does. For example, Cleric 22/Cot 14 gets you the CoT bonus feat, +2 to all saves, and level 9 spells and epic spells, depending on when you took the cleric levels.

Cheers.

Also note the builder's apparent design intentions - this build is a caster, not a true meleer (based on the name of the character build). Accordingly, the builder opted to lower AB by saving the CoT for epic levels when the CoT epic feats could be used for Great Wisdom, to improve the spellcasting.

If the original build had been a more martial Paladain/CoT build then greater AB would definitely be applicable. But like the Wise Guy build recently posted, this is a divine caster build.

Kaliban
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