Hello everyone. This is my first build, and as such I won’t be at all surprised if it contains errors. The idea of the build is to create a pure dual-wielder who relies on speed, dexterity, and well-placed blows to kill opponents quickly. He excels at fighting multiple opponents simultaneously. His defense relies on avoidance rather than mitigation, so for both RP reasons and practicality, he tends to use robes or very light armor. After I started working on this build, I found the Tempest class in the PRC. The Tempest is much closer to what I’d actually like, but this is a fun alternative using only Bioware classes.

Roleplay:
The Twinblade has dedicated his body and soul to an ideal joining of his weapons to his body. He strives to go beyond one man with two weapons, to become one weapon with two points. His weapons are identical in all mundane respects, and he scarcely notices which blade is in which hand. Twinblades are trained to fight multiple opponents simultaneously, extending their personal philosophies to view a group of foes as one enemy with many vulnerable target points. A Twinblade will actively scorn any but the most basic defensive tactics and equipment that do not rise from his own speed and skill, instead relying on a simple mantra: the best defense is the absence of attackers.

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(I borrowed Cinnabar’s post format, since it seemed pretty clear. Thanks!)

Twinblade
Fighter 16/Weapon Master 19/Rogue 5
Playable from level 1 to level 40, PvM
Human, any alignment

Starting Stats:
STR 14
DEX 16
CON 14
INT 14
WIS 8
CHA 10

Progression:
1) Fighter 1 – Weapon Finesse, Ambidexterity, Two-Weapon Fighting
2) Rogue 1
3) Fighter 2 – Dodge, Weapon Focus (short sword)
4) Fighter 3
5) Fighter 4 – Mobility
6) Fighter 5 – Expertise
7) Fighter 6 – Spring Attack Fighter 7
9) Fighter 8 – Whirlwind Attack, Weapon Specialization (short sword)
10) Weapon Master 1
11) Weapon Master 2
12) Rogue 2 – Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
13) Weapon Master 3
14) Weapon Master 4
15) Weapon Master 5 – Improved Critical
16) Weapon Master 6
17) Weapon Master 7
18) Weapon Master 8 – Toughness
19) Weapon Master 9
20) Fighter 9
21) Fighter 10 – Epic Weapon Focus (SS), Epic Weapon Specialization (SS)
22) Rogue 3
23) Fighter 11
24) Fighter 12 – Power Attack, Cleave
25) Weapon Master 10
26) Weapon Master 11
27) Weapon Master 12 – Great Cleave
28) Weapon Master 13 – Overwhelming Critical
29) Weapon Master 14
30) Weapon Master 15 – Armor Skin
31) Weapon Master 16 – Epic Prowess
32) Rogue 4
33) Fighter 13 – Damage Reduction 1
34) Fighter 14 – Damage Reduction 2
35) Fighter 15
36) Fighter 16 – Improved Whirlwind Attack, Damage Reduction 3
37) Weapon Master 17
38) Weapon Master 18
39) Weapon Master 19 – Epic Toughness 1, Blind Fight
40) Rogue 5

Final Stats:
STR 16
DEX 20
CON 18
INT 14
WIS 8
CHA 10

Final Skills:
Heal 30, Discipline 42, Tumble 40, UMD 43, Disable Trap 43, Search 43

AB with plain Short Sword (dual wielding): 43
Crit threat/multiplier with plain Short Sword: 15-20/x3 (+2d6)
3d6 sneak attack

Max HP: 518

Naked Saves:
Fortitude 20
Reflex 25
Will 11

I’m not quite sure how to figure his naked armor class. He would have bonuses of +5 from dexterity, +2 from armor skin, and +1 from dodge, but I don’t know what number to add those bonuses to. I’d appreciate any help with that.

I had originally intended to make this build about 90% offensive and 10% defensive, but ‘operational realities’ force me to put in a few more defensive stats and feats. With a good henchman, or in a group with a healer, several of the defensive feats could be traded for offensive ones. As he is, he’s pretty impressive offensively and adequate defensively. The ability to wear almost any gear should allow you to balance the character more or less either way. Also, of course, he can heal and buff himself fairly effectively.

His will save is abysmal. He’d have to be very conscious of this and seek potions or immunity items.

As I said, this is my first full build. If anyone has any suggestions, corrections, or advice, I’d definitely like to hear them. A few things I'll point out (btw, you're welcome to use my format if you like - I know I'm used to it, so I find it really easy to read!):

I'd delay the TWF feat a bit, since you suffer penalties while dual-wielding and you don't want that at low levels where your AB is low. I'd take Dodge at level 1, Mobility at level 3, and TWF at level 5 or 6. That's usually where I find dual-wielding starts to become effective. Until then, just go sword and board. That's just a personal bias, though.

I'd take that last Rogue level at level 37. You can still get high Search and Disable Trap if you want (40 each). You'll get UMD to 40 and, since the skill relies on multiples of 5, that's all you need. You might also consider putting points into Spellcraft, as you get a +1 bonus on your saves vs spells for each 5 modified ranks in it. 18 ranks (it will cost 36 skill points, as it's cross classed) is enough for +4 to saves vs spells, which will help a lot on that Will save.

Speaking of Will saves, I think you've miscalculated that one. It should be 15. And the others should be:

Fort: 23
Refl: 27

I also think your AB is miscalculated. You have BAB +19 at level 20. That means +29 at level 40.

+1 Weapon Focus
+2 Epic WF
+1 Epic Prowess
+4 Weapon Master levels
+5 Weapon Finesse

Total: +42. Dual wielding woould drop that to +40.

Another thing: you can't take Damage Reduction with only 18 CON. You need a minimum 21 CON to take those feats.

I'd also advise not splitting your ability increases into 3 different stats. If you really want the DR feats, then I'd advise going for CON and DEX (but you'd really need to min/max the build for that by starting with higher CON, which means lower CHA and/or STR). Otherwise, put all your increases to DEX.

Overwhelming Critical requires STR of 23+, so that's another feat for which you won't qualify.

Improved Whirlwind requires a minimum DEX of 23 to qualify as well.

Your AC is base 10, then add all modifiers:

10
+5 (DEX)
+2 (Armor Skin)
+8 (Tumble)

total 25. Generally Dodge and Mobility aren't counted in that total, as they're situational and don't apply all the time.

Your build is an interesting concept but needs a lot of reworking to figure out what you want to keep and what you'll be willing to drop. Feel free to ask for advice if you need help. There are plenty of people here that are good resources for building characters.
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It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!!
Quote: AB with plain Short Sword (dual wielding): 43
Not sure if this is right:

Your BAB is 19. +10 in Epic, +5 for Dex, +4Super WF, +3EWF, +1Epic Prowess= 42. -2 for dualwielding= 40.

While that is still a good AB, it's not good enough if you have 19 levels of Weapon Master. You could easily increase that by 5 or 6 with some adjustment to your attributes and how you spread your points in level ups.

I normally like the idea of going Dexterity based, but you might be better served to go the way of Strength since you have little back-up against crit-immune creatures.
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Ariel, Ookla, RIDE! Thanks very much for the input. Apparently I didn't quite understand the formula for increasing BAB, and I simply didn't know the base AC value. I will rework the build. Is it considered better to edit an existing build or post a new version of the same build?

BTW... when figuring required ability scores for certain feats, do ability bonuses from gear count? If I get STR up to 23 with gear, can I take Overwhelming Critical? That'd be great for making the build work, but I'm not sure I'd agree with it from a roleplay point of view.

Thanks again for all the help!
Quote: Posted 07/12/05 21:20:32 (GMT) -- SovranSpecific

Thanks very much for the input. Apparently I didn't quite understand the formula for increasing BAB, and I simply didn't know the base AC value. I will rework the build. Is it considered better to edit an existing build or post a new version of the same build?

BTW... when figuring required ability scores for certain feats, do ability bonuses from gear count? If I get STR up to 23 with gear, can I take Overwhelming Critical? That'd be great for making the build work, but I'm not sure I'd agree with it from a roleplay point of view.

Thanks again for all the help!

For meeting Feat prereqs, you need a raw score. Never count equipment.

As for AC, start with a base of 10. I usually throw in mundane armor or shield if any, add Tumble(+8 in this case), and Armor Skin. You can even toss in Dodge for 1 AC if you want. Based upon your current build design, his naked AC is 10+8+2+5+1(dodge)=26. Throw on some Leather armor(his Dex will give him +5)=28. Toss on a Tower shield= 31. Wearing Plate and Tower shield =32.
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Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
Quote: SovranSpecific

Is it considered better to edit an existing build or post a new version of the same build?

(You can't edit an existing build unless ...it's within the 30 min time limit)

OK ..you have 3 option's...

1. You can post a new version here.
2. You can post a new version in its own topic.
3. "PM" me your new version and i will swap your original build post with the new version.

It's entirely up to you !... Whatever you choose is just fine.

griphook

Edited By griphook on 07/13/05 01:39