There are rumours that have circulated throughout the Warriors Guild of many cities that an elite few are always on duty. Though few in number, the Shadowsong Knights, as they are called, are believed to be the very last defense against certain enemies. Not your typical warriors, they excel at quick movement, easily dodging and evading blows that would easily cleave through your average fighter. They are just as quick with their own weapons, prefering to use two weapons to quickly hack away at their opponents. But the Shadowsong Knights are much more than a quick eye and quicker hand, but they also have learned and studied for many years, just to become initiates. The youngest member to this Elite Corps was 49. Their studies have allowed them to learn the workings of magic, yet they are not direct users of arcane arts. They have learned also the secrets of the shadows, using them to conceal and aid them in battle. Their are few things more unnerving than to see a dozen warriors, chanting, appearing in the midst of your camp, injuring many of your comrades beforing vanishing back into the night air. Those cities who have such elite soldiers have never been worried by enemies camping outside their gates...
Leveling is really a matter of what you need when. Essentially start out with Fighter, grab your needed combat feats, then a level of Bard for dumping skill points and then grab 2 levels of Shadowdancer. Finish off the pre-epic with 12 Fighter, 4 Bard and 4 Shadowdancer. Epic levels, go for broke, and hit your 10th level of Shadowdancer before you get to 30 Dex. Use your Fighter levels to grab a few feats and then finish off with Shadowdancer and Bard. The key is to intersperse Bard levels every so often to increase essential skills.
Strengths: Epic Dodge avoids damage on first attack of each round. Skills allow use of all equipment, scrolls, wands or magic thingies (technical term), prevention of combat feats, bonus to AC, saves against spells, access to Bardsong, slight heal bonus and identification of most pre-epic equipment. Permanent 40% concealment. HiPs and IKD give greater versatility in combat. Improved Expertise helps against tough warriors in melee (if they need to fight head on is upon you) Summon Shadow: Built in meat shield (who is also partially concealed) Darkvision, Defensive Roll, Improved Evasion, Uncanny Dodge III. Shadow daze works wonders against low will fighters and rogues. Shadow Concealment is a quick way to boost AC, and give a slight damage reduction. For a short, high burst, cast all three at once, giving +12 to AC for 10 rounds (perhaps to use a spell or escape if enemy has True Seeing)
Weaknesses: Low HP. Low Will and Fort save. Spellcraft helps a bit, as does Slippery Mind. Can also buff up with scrolls of Death Ward, Protect from Align/Lesser Mind Blank, and others (mostly druid/cleric spells for help against fort saves, but Shadow shield also comes to mind.) Low Strength. A nice Strength belt, or weapon with good elemental damage will supplement this. EPS also helps, doubling the damage output of the humble handaxe. Crits help alot (keen edge scrolls), but spells may be needed (darkfire/flame weapon, GMW especially come to mind).
I tried this build out, with just clothing, a tower shield, and two handaxes against a fighter, rogue, mage and cleric. all fell quickly. with some monk robes & boots, nice cloak, elemental immunity and +8 handaxes he took out a prismatic dragon. Took maybe 4 minutes or so. Had to drink a potion to ensure no crit would take him out. Basically, against fighters and rogues, use shadow daze, ramp up the AC against the fighters, and have at them. disappear in combat to confuse and annoy. against cleric and mage just strike from shadows repeatedly.
I am tired. Time for bed. Please excuse any and all spelling errors.
Let the criticisms and suggestions fly!
-C _________________ "Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement."
Edited By griphook on 08/12/05 14:55
Quote: Posted 08/10/05 07:20:40 (GMT) -- christian.schnabel Shadow Concealment is a quick way to boost AC, and give a slight damage reduction. For a short, high burst, cast all three at once, giving +12 to AC for 10 rounds (perhaps to use a spell or escape if enemy has True Seeing)
I assume this is supposed to be Shadow Evade...have you actually tested that it works this way with the AC? AFAIK, no spell or special ability can stack with itself, at least when it's coming from the same source (e.g. for a cleric/blackguard, the cleric spell Bull Strength and the blackguard special 1/day Bull's Strength can stack, but not two castings of Bull's Strength). Plus, I thought the duration was 5 rounds, and since it takes a round to use it...even if it did stack, it would only be +12 for like 2-3 rounds.
Anyway, was just curious about that.
Steve
Quote: Posted 08/10/05 07:33:40 (GMT) -- Stravinsky00 Plus, I thought the duration was 5 rounds, and since it takes a round to use it...even if it did stack, it would only be +12 for like 2-3 rounds.
Anyway, was just curious about that.
Steve
It doesnt stack , you are quite correct.
Syrath _________________ It's SHADOWDANCER, dammit, shadowdancer!!!
I've seen it stack - offline and online. You have to increase the time that it lasts in order to notice the difference - in my case, offline I have it bumped to 15 rounds.
On the PW I play on, shadowevade is extended to several rounds, makes the class more worthwhile imho. HiPS does nothing truly useful there since most mobs and all but one epic bosses have truesight.
Edited By Khandahr on 08/10/05 10:34
I stand corrected, the AC bonus from shadowevade does stack. Ive submitted it as a bug report, because it shouldnt.
Syrath _________________ It's SHADOWDANCER, dammit, shadowdancer!!!
Oh and to the original poster, its a nice build. However Ive yet to make a build that with magical equipment and +8 weapons failed to take out a prismatic dragon.
Ive only created one to do it with no magical equipment whatsoever. Ive also only created one dex build/ED/concealment build that easily took out a level 40 fighter without using hips when equipment with normal equipment. With hips ive taken out the very same fighter with a level 10 character however.
Syrath _________________ It's SHADOWDANCER, dammit, shadowdancer!!!
Heh I remember testing a HiPS vs. Anuis and I was overloading hsi system with hiding and then unloading 5 hits and rehiding before he could get an attack in. I would crash him every time. That being said, I think you may want to look at assigning some specific levels to classes. There is definately some min/maxing that can be done that you are not giving people the slightest idea how to do. For instance if you take bard as your first level you lose nothing except a bonus feat, but gain quite a few more skill points. If you assign levels in certain ways it could mean the difference between three attacks a round or four. I know you posted a 12/4/4 split for level 20, but I don;t see why you can't push a couple fighter levels up earlier and move some bard levels or shad dancer levels later to get some higher AB. Another thing to look at is how level splits pre epic affect your saving throws. Well hope this helps. _________________ Come visit the Epic Builders Guild for all the character info you could ever want or need: Click Here
Quote: That being said, I think you may want to look at assigning some specific levels to classes. There is definately some min/maxing that can be done that you are not giving people the slightest idea how to do
Quite right. I was tired, and couldn't be bothered to finish typing it out properly. My apologies. Here is how I leveled that char.
21)Shadowdancer5, Great Dex I (DEX 24) 22)Shadowdancer6 23)Shadowdancer7 24)Shadowdancer8, Great Dex II (DEX 26) 25)Shadowdancer9 26)Shadowdancer10 27)Bard5, Great Dex III (DEX 27) 28)Fighter13 (DEX 28) 29)Fighter14, EWF 30)Fighter15, Great Dex IV (DEX 29) 31)Fighter16, EWS 32)Bard6 (DEX 30) 33)Shadowdancer11, Epic Dodge 34)Shadowdancer12 35)Shadowdancer13, SC I 36)Bard7, SC II (DEX 31) 37)Shadowdancer14 38)Shadowdancer15 39)Shadowdancer16, SC III, IV 40)Bard (DEX 32)
Now that this is here, I am sure many will tell me how poorly I leveled, but feel free...I am not very good at getting the dodgy/SC feats quickly, so I am sure there is a better way.
Quote: I assume this is supposed to be Shadow Evade
Yes it is. Nice catch. I was tired and didn't remember correctly. But yes it does stack. I thought it lasted for 10 rounds, but perhaps I was wrong again...well, it is for a (very) short boost to AC, which is what it accomplishes. I am not sure whether to consider it a bug, since the skill is kinda useless with such a short duration anyways, maybe they left it in for just such an emergency?
Quote: However Ive yet to make a build that with magical equipment and +8 weapons failed to take out a prismatic dragon.
Good point. I tried him with normal equipment, but without a higher AB from spells or equipment he just couldn't hit the dragon, except once every few minutes, and more because the dragon fell on his blade by accident, i suspect. also you need the ac boost against a powerful melee attacker. with fighters you have impr expertise, still with enough umph to hit back, but dragons...oh well, never said it was a GOOD build...
Quote: For instance if you take bard as your first level you lose nothing except a bonus feat, but gain quite a few more skill points.
I also lose the ability to have CHA lower than 10, i believe. and at level 1 you really need weapon finesse.
Quote: I know you posted a 12/4/4 split for level 20, but I don;t see why you can't push a couple fighter levels up earlier and move some bard levels or shad dancer levels later to get some higher AB
With a dual wielding AB of 40, for a non WM build, is pretty good, I thought. Also, without the fighter levels in the epic, I lose out on EWF and EWS, which I thought took a lot away from the build. Also, what feats would you take pre-epic? Nothing really important sprung to mind, but you could always remove iron will for something else if you like. heck, even removing the TWF, Ambi and ITWF would net you lotsa room to play with pre-epic feats, but this build seemed to be lacking epic feats to me. I also didn't give a thought to saves in pre-epic...dang. Oh well, just another thing which can now be commented and corrected by those about me.
You need 10 Hide to take Shadowdancer. The earliest it's possible to take Shadowdancer is level 8
Steve
You can take epic weapon focus on any feat. You only need to take one level of fighter post epic to get EWS. I don't see anythign in your buidl to shift up your fighter levels for a highe AB woudl wreck anything. It's of course your call how you want to do the split. _________________ Come visit the Epic Builders Guild for all the character info you could ever want or need: Click Here
Man..I just can't get this straight can I? Back to the scrap heap with me...
Quote: You can take epic weapon focus on any feat. You only need to take one level of fighter post epic to get EWS
Very true, but I needed the normal epic feats for great dex, so i couldn't spare one for EWF...unless you see a another option that my poor useless brain didn't, perhaps...please? Would shifting 3 fighter levels pre-epic increase the base AB? I thought it would end up the same...
oops...first 10 levels should be
Would shifting 3 fighter levels pre-epic increase the base AB? I thought it would end up the same... 