There is something uniquely satisfying in playing a good assassin build. I've been mod-slumming with the Huntress in the last few days, and found her to be quite effective, efficient, and reasonably balanced. Ultravision, Darkness, Improved Knockdown, Epic Weapon Specialization, Improved Invisibility, solid skill set, high stealth scores, high crit potential, UMD, good AC, excellent dualwielding AB, an impressive Death Attack DC at 38, and then topped with 13d6 Sneak with the capacity to launch 78d6 per round, the Huntress has a huge toolbox at her disposal. She even manages to pull off some decent saves.
With a list like that, what doesn't she have, you ask? Two things really. Hide in Plain Sight, and Epic Dodge. Frankly, if she had that, then everybody would want one, and she would be the quintessential Assassin build. She certainly has enough ways to generate sneaks, so HiPS is really no great loss.
Plenty of room is left in the Epic portion for PW customization. With 9 Great Dex feats taken, one can easily drop two for Armor Skin and an Epic Save feat. There is also room in the Skill Point section for customization. If Craft Traps isn't viable, or Spellcraft not required due to items, she can easily make investments into Listen, Search, etc.
Human is chosen for race due to the skill-point hunger Assassins are afflicted with. Dwarves are a close second. Half-elves third. All other races incur XP penalties.
What does a Death Attack DC 38 mean? It means that a 40th level warrior with a 29 Fort Save has a 24% chance of failing. In testing, the Huntress, with no items at all, no buffs, completely naked, literally, with ordinary kukris, stealthed behind him, lands her first flurry, both hits. The Warrior makes his first save with a 10+29=39. Just made it. His second roll, however, was a 7+29=36. Poor guy, he didn't make that one. He was a but a memory by the end of the next round....the long kiss goodnight. _____
The Huntress: Ranger10/Ftr4/Assassin26 Human Alignment: Any/Evil Playable 1-40, PvM
Str14 Int14 Wis12 Dex15(34) Con14 Chr8
1 Ranger1, Exotics, Knockdown, FE 2 Fighter1, WF: Kukris 3 Fighter2, Blindfighting, Weapon Finesse 4 Ranger2, Dex16 5 Ranger3 6 Assassin1, Stealthy 7 Assassin2, (Ghostly Visage) 8 Assassin3, Dex17 9 Ranger4, Improved Knockdown, (Ultravision) 10 Ranger5, FE 11 Assassin4 12 Assassin5, Improved Crit: Kukri, Dex18, (Darkness) 13 Ranger6 14 Ranger7 15 Ranger8, Iron Will 16 Ranger9, Dex19 17 Assassin6 18 Assassin7, Toughness, (Invisibility) 19 Assassin8 20 Fighter3, Dex20 21 Assassin9, EWF: Kukris, (Improved Invisibility) 22 Assassin10 23 Assassin11 24 Fighter4, WS/EWS: Kukri, Dex21 25 Assassin12 26 Assassin13 27 Assassin14, Great Dex I, II 28 Assassin15, Dex24 29 Assassin16 30 Assassin17, Great Dex III 31 Assassin18, Great Dex IV 32 Assassin19, Dex27 33 Assassin20, Great Dex V 34 Assassin21 35 Assassin22, Great Dex VI 36 Assassin23, Great Dex VII, Dex31 37 Assassin24 38 Assassin25 39 Ranger10, Epic Prowess, Great Dex VIII 40 Assassin26, Great Dex IX, Dex34
AB: 44 Dualwielding Kukris: 42/37/33/27/42/37 AC: 30 (33 w/Tower Shield) Death Attack DC: 38 Sneak Attack: 13d6 (78d6 per round) Hit Points: 410
you forgot the final FE at level 39. not a big deal or anything. also, nice HP for an assassin.
I was going to ask how you got 78d6 damage, but then i thought about it and read more carefully, and then lightning hit me and i got it... i'm a little slow.
nice. with impr invis, i don't think you really miss epic dodge all that much. IKD is the one thing that i think you miss the most, but with stealth and Death attack, its probably a moot point. one could, of course, take away 2 great dex and solve that minor point.
-c _________________ Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
nice. with impr invis, i don't think you really miss epic dodge all that much. IKD is the one thing that i think you miss the most, but with stealth and Death attack, its probably a moot point. one could, of course, take away 2 great dex and solve that minor point.
-c
He has Improved Knockdown.
This build is excellent and a good variety from the original and much more cool IMHO ranger/sd/assassin. In fact I would say that a ranger/sd/assassin is much better than the huntress version but only in a game of level 40. _________________ Be realistic...
Quote: Posted 09/06/05 12:43:06 (GMT) -- grizzled_dwarflord 39 Ranger10, Epic Prowess, Great Dex VIII
you forgot the final FE at level 39. not a big deal or anything.
No, not forgotten. Replaced. In Epic, a Ranger can choose EWF, Epic Prowess and Epic Toughness(and 1 or 2 others) in place of Favored Enemy. The beauty in delaying that 10th Ranger level is you nab an Epic bonus feat and can max your Discipline Skill.
Quote: nice. with impr invis, i don't think you really miss epic dodge all that much. IKD is the one thing that i think you miss the most, but with stealth and Death attack, its probably a moot point. one could, of course, take away 2 great dex and solve that minor point.
On the contrary. IKD is taken, and at Level 9. I've yet to make an Assassin build without Improved Knockdown. _________________ Got Hommlet? World of Greyhawk Action Server (with 1/2 price ales on Mondays!)
This build is excellent and a good variety from the original and much more cool IMHO ranger/sd/assassin. In fact I would say that a ranger/sd/assassin is much better than the huntress version but only in a game of level 40.
I knew inevitably comparisons would be made to the Dark Stalker. The Dark Stalker is good assassin, but not the best. You are correct that at Lvl 40, the Dark Stalker may be better, but only under certain conditions. Observe the differences in which the Huntress outperforms him:
The categories in which the DarkStalker outperforms Huntress:
Stealth: 63 / 57 HiPS: Yes / No Epic Dodge: Lvl39 / No Initiative: Faster/ Fast
And that's basically it. I assumed in the Sneak Attack category that Improved Sneak wasn't nerfed, but as it stands right now, anybody building a Dark Stalker would have to toss in some Great Dex feats. Also, Epic Dodge in my mind is the great equalizer, especially when facing melee builds. At lvl 39 and 40, I would say that makes all the difference in a direct comparison. But for those first 38 levels, I don't think he can hold a candle to the Huntress. _________________ Got Hommlet? World of Greyhawk Action Server (with 1/2 price ales on Mondays!)
Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
Why exotic and kukris instead of just 2 daggers? Does the extended crit-range really matter in this build? Would free up a feat ... _________________ What's the best suit of armor for a channelor? Full Plate. Shine it up, polish it, maybe enchant it a little, put it on a fighter and keep him between you and trouble
Quote: Posted 09/06/05 17:17:02 (GMT) -- Separ
Why exotic and kukris instead of just 2 daggers? Does the extended crit-range really matter in this build? Would free up a feat ...
There is a noticeable difference, especially in pre-epic, in the amount of criticals landed with a kukri. I tend to build my sneak attackers to be a little beefy so I can stand toe-to-toe with opposition. In so doing, not all attacks are going to be sneak attacks, and without WS/EWS not coming until Lvl24, that leaves only a 14Strength to help with the damage output. Celebrating a 15-20 crit Range by level 12 and with ITWF coming at Lvl16, it makes a marked improvement in damage output.
Second, Exotic Weapon proficiency is quite useful. She can now use any weapon in the game, which gives her much needed versatility in dealing with specialized opponents. How many times has someone found that Exotic Bastard sword that deals +X damage to dragons, and the end-boss is a dragon, and the party is looking at each other and asking, "Do you have Exotic? I don't have Exotic..."
Third, using UMD, it is possible for to cast Keen on a Kurki since they are a slashing weapon. Daggers are piercing.
Fourth, she's not really feat-starved. Sure, it would be nice to have another feat, but Exotic is probably the best investment, particulary pre-epic.
Fifth, kukris just look a lot sharper and cooler than daggers or shortswords.
But having said all that, one can always drop Exotic and take daggers or shortswords. I have a pure Assassin build that enjoys maces. I think in most builds weapons are really a personal choice and preference, and really don't affect the outcome of a build. Yet in this build, which has feats to spare, if you can get Exotic I don't really see a reason not to take it. _________________ Got Hommlet? World of Greyhawk Action Server (with 1/2 price ales on Mondays!)
No, not forgotten. Replaced. In Epic, a Ranger can choose EWF, Epic Prowess and Epic Toughness(and 1 or 2 others) in place of Favored Enemy. The beauty in delaying that 10th Ranger level is you nab an Epic bonus feat and can max your Discipline Skill.
On the contrary. IKD is taken, and at Level 9. I've yet to make an Assassin build without Improved Knockdown.
for some reason, even though i read HiPS, and i was thinking HiPS, i wrote IKD. And then i went further to say that you needed to drop feats. i think you should just ignore my posts from now on...after this one.
that FE thing was just plain goofiness on my part.
sorry for the confusion.
-c
I think this is my favourite assassin build or something very similar The 3 classes blend together very well and its nice to be able to fight toe-to-toe with most foes if the Death Attack/IKD doesn't work. _________________ Teaching men a lesson in combat etiquette.
This build is excellent and a good variety from the original and much more cool IMHO ranger/sd/assassin. In fact I would say that a ranger/sd/assassin is much better than the huntress version but only in a game of level 40.
I knew inevitably comparisons would be made to the Dark Stalker. The Dark Stalker is good assassin, but not the best. You are correct that at Lvl 40, the Dark Stalker may be better, but only under certain conditions. Observe the differences in which the Huntress outperforms him:
Darkstalker / Huntress
Let be me the first to say in this thread that the dark stalker sucks. It is very weak version of a ranger/sd/assassin build. You can easily get around 40 AB with duel wield with a ranger/sd/assassin. Your huntress is the best combat wise build of an real assassin type build and the dark stalker is an obselete version of build that can be one of the most deadliest of their kind.
A build like this was never meant to hit crit immune, sneak immune, true seeing, and resistance monsters. It's for killing other PCs and monsters with fair Fort. That is why a ranger/sd/assassin will be much better.
And the AB is really good on the huntress and it can even match in direct melee combat when comparing to it to other builds with mid 40's AB. But when you attack out from stealth....AB is not really that big of a question. _________________ Be realistic...
A build like this was never meant to hit crit immune, sneak immune, true seeing, and resistance monsters. It's for killing other PCs and monsters with fair Fort. That is why a ranger/sd/assassin will be much better.
For some reason, I disagree. That goes for all finesse builds, not just this one. A Ranger/SD/Assassin will have just as difficult time with the above-mentioned creatures as the next guy. HiPS, while it will keep them alive, isn't going to take the enemy out. All else being equal in a situation vs. crit immune/true seeing, I would give the Huntress the edge over a DarkStalker variant due to more attacks and just more base damage, hit points and AC. While she doesn't have Shadow Evade, she does have Cat's Grace and a few other nifty Ranger spells to help out.
Bare in mind that I think I know what you are trying to say. I absolutely share your disappointment with the state of the current Dark Stalker. He has grown old, has wizened somewhat, and is long in the tooth. A new breed of Assassin crouches in the shadows of the horizon, watching, knowing, waiting, to knife the old man in the back, and with a grim smile stand above his lifeless corpse and take his place on the Epic Page.
Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
I think it would be good to post a better and updated version of the Dark Stalker. I shall do it personally _________________ Be realistic...
Especially the ones with a blade to my throat _________________ Teaching men a lesson in combat etiquette.
I really enjoyed this build while playing at a level 40 PW. But now - moving to a lvl 30 capped PW I have to adjust it a bit.
What should I consider, when cutting down this builds idea to level 30. All that is gained after level 30 is Dex and Epic Prowess? So nothing too crucial.
I'd actually build it the same way but stop at Level 30. Is it worth to sacrifice 1 Greater Dex to take a Ranger Level for Discipline?
But if I didn't take the ranger level I'd end up with odd Dex. Or I had to cut down on an ability score to start with 16 Dex. (I'd take Con I think) Any suggestions?
Edited By johnstonee on 05/09/10 12:17
Holy Crap! I think this is the very first entry of the Dwarven Assassin's guild! If im not mistaken, this is the build that started the chaos that lasted in 2005 thru 2006... You shall be hunted and gutted from bringing up this evilness!!! LOL jk
Thanks man! I forgot about this guy. Hey, we never made an actual Dwarven assassin's guild, did we Griz?
i'm a little slow.
i think you should just ignore my posts from now on...after this one. 
