Nature(al) Born Killer - (Druid 29 / CoT 11)
Playable lvl 1-40 - PvM

Human
Neutral Alignment

Str 14
Dex 14
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 16 (36)
Cha 8

1 Druid (1) - Spell Penetration, Spell Focus: Necromancy
2 Druid (2)
3 Druid (3) - Empower Spell
4 Druid (4) [Wis 17]
5 Druid (5)
6 Druid (6) - Improved Spell Focus: Necromancy
7 Druid (7)
8 Druid (8) [Wis 18]
9 Druid (9) - Improved Unarmed Strike
10 Druid (10)
11 Druid (11)
12 Druid (12) - Stunning Fist, [Wis 19]
13 Druid (13)
14 Druid (14)
15 Druid (15) - Weapon Focus: Scimitar
16 Druid (16) [Wis 20]
17 Druid (17)
18 Druid (18) - Extra Stunning Attacks
19 Druid (19)
20 Druid (20) [Wis 21]

21 CoT (1) - Great Wisdom I [Wis 22]
22 CoT (2) - Great Wisdom II* [Wis 23]
23 CoT (3)
24 CoT (4) - Great Wisdom III [Wis 24], Great Wisdom IV* [Wis 25], [Wis 26]
25 CoT (5)
26 CoT 6) - Great Wisdom V* [Wis 27]
27 CoT (7) - Great Wisdom VI [Wis 28]
28 CoT (8) - Great Wisdom VII* [Wis 29], [Wis 30]
29 CoT (9)
30 Druid (21) - Dragon Shape
31 CoT (10) - Great Wisdom VIII* [Wis 31]
32 Druid (22) [Wis 32]
33 Druid (23) - Great Wisdom IX [Wis 33]
34 Druid (24) - Great Wisdom X** [Wis 34]
35 Druid (25)
36 Druid (26) - Epic Prowess, [Wis 35]
37 Druid (27)
38 Druid (28) - Energy Resistance (x)**
39 Druid (29) - Armor Skin
40 CoT (11) [Wis 36]

*-CoT Bonus Feats
**-Druid Epic Bonus Feats

AB 28
AC 20

Stunning Fist DC - 43 (Base 10 + 1/2 CL (20) + Wis Mod (13))
with Owls Insight - 49 (43 + 6)

Fortitude 29
Reflex 23
Will 40

Skills: With 5 skill points per level, I would max Concentration, and Spellcraft and then cross class Search and/or Tumble. I would also dump points into Discipline on the CoT levels as well. But the choice is up to you.
_________________________________

Build notes:
This is somewhat of a concept build, but I did a bit of testing in the Novice to Epic Mod at different levels and using different forms and it is decently effective. I basically wanted to make a Druid with a mix good spell casting and good natural forms. Due to comments in a thread long past by cdaulepp; I thought I would throw the Improved Unarmed Fighting and Stunning Fist into the mix to give the shapes an extra punch (no pun intended).

With such a high Wisdom, and Owl's Insight, rarely were the Stunning Fists resisted. The only class that seemed to give me any problem were the high-dex rogues. Which is why I chose Necromancy as a spell focus. If I had trouble hitting them, I would just pop back into natural form and use Slay Living or Finger of Death on them. Otherwise, I had very little trouble with the Fighters at during my leveling testing (stun them and then beat them to death).

Before you say it, yes, putting even one level of Monk in here would put this build into a whole different level. Upping the AC by 19 at level 40; and giving an extra 2 attacks per round with your shapes. But, as Druid-Shifter-Monks are so ubiquitous, I wanted to try something that is still feasible, but a little more palatable to the RP-minded.

I had toyed around with the idea of taking 4 levels of CoT pre-epic for an extra attack per round; but after some consideration, I felt that it was better to get the spell Shapechange as early as possible.

Also, let me add that with the high Stunning Fist DC, good management of the Panther companion can really make an impact in battle. Have your Panther stay back while you cast any spells and then shift into a form for melee. Then when everyone is focused on you, let your panther devastate their flanks. The panther is a bit fragile, but with Barkskin, Stoneskin, Empowered Bull's Strength and Greater Magic Fang, he (she?), can handle (and dish out) quite a bit more damage.

If you have any questions about the shape stats, you can check the Grimiore (if you do a search, someone should have a link to it) all the stats are there. But for the sake of comparison, I am going to list the AB and AC of the various shapes. Both normal and buffed (Barkskin and Empowered Bulls Strength).

Normal (Unbuffed)
Bear Wolf Boar Panther Badger
AC 16 AC 20 AC 20 AC 20 AC 23
AB 35 AB 32 AB 33 AB 32 AB 27

Fire Ele. Water Ele. Earth Ele. Air Ele.
AC 20 AC 26 AC 20 AC 32
AB 34 AB 34 AB 37 AB 31

Dragon Form (Feat)
AC 43
AB 44
_______________________

Buffed (Barkskin, Empowered Bulls Strength (+6 strength))
Bear Wolf Boar Panther Badger
AC 21 AC 25 AC 25 AC 25 AC 28
AB 39 AB 36 AB 37 AB 36 AB 30

Fire Ele. Water Ele. Earth Ele. Air Ele.
AC 25 AC 31 AC 25 AC 37
AB 35 AB 38 AB 40 AB 35

Dragon Form (Feat)
AC 48
AB 47

Some of these stats don't make much sense to me (the Fire Elemental's AB only going up 1 point despite the boost to strength), but I'm not especially knowledgeable about the Druid shapes and the mechanics involved. I'm also not certain what properties are merged. I've seen different charts for the Shifter, but not on the Druid natural forms. From a little testing it appears that it's Armor and perhaps items, but not Weapons (or bracers, iirc).

Anyway, it's no Shifter-Monk; but it is a Druid that makes good use of his natural forms and spells. Probably only good in a low magic environment, though.

Cheers.

Edited By griphook on 12/26/05 15:23

Is there a reason for not going Druid 28/CoT 10/<something-not-Monk> 2?

I question the usefulness of one lone Epic Energy Resistance... pick up WF & EWF on Unarmed Strike for god's sake! And an Epic Spell Focus would be nice, too.

Actually I'd change the spell focus to Conjuration, but that's just a matter of preference. Conjuration has Grease, Stonehold and Storm of Vengeance, all of which disable your opponents (Storm inflicts damage aswell), and should be used in conjuction with the ultimate no-SR spell, Creeping Doom.

Though there is - in my opinion - room for some polishing, it's a nice concept, good job.

EDIT: as it is, you've a 100% chance to penetrate 32 SR and going with 28 Druid reduces this to a mere 95%. The only downside, I'd say.

As for the something-not-Monk, Druid/CoT/Barbarian sounds cool
_________________
Surely, without war there would be no loss - hence, no mourning, no grief, no pain, no misery...

Edited By FinneousPJ on 12/12/05 14:16

It should be noted that the moment you take monk you link your stunning fists uses per day to your monk lvl. That's the only reason not to take monk IMO and compared to free improved unarmed attack, monk's progression for your unarmed forms, cleave, evasion and +13 AC (+19 w/WIS capped) that just one lvl of monk would give (when the 11th lvl of CoT gives just +2HP)it's a veeery weak reason...

But maybe I'm just a powergamer

Cheers,
Kail
_________________
Dilegua notte
Tramontate stelle
Tramontate stelle
All'alba vinceṛ
Vinceṛ
Vinceṛ
Quote: Posted 12/12/05 14:14:22 (GMT) -- FinneousPJ

Is there a reason for not going Druid 28/CoT 10/<something-not-Monk> 2?

I question the usefulness of one lone Epic Energy Resistance... pick up WF & EWF on Unarmed Strike for god's sake! And an Epic Spell Focus would be nice, too.

Actually I'd change the spell focus to Conjuration, but that's just a matter of preference. Conjuration has Grease, Stonehold and Storm of Vengeance, all of which disable your opponents (Storm inflicts damage aswell), and should be used in conjuction with the ultimate no-SR spell, Creeping Doom.

Though there is - in my opinion - room for some polishing, it's a nice concept, good job.

EDIT: as it is, you've a 100% chance to penetrate 32 SR and going with 28 Druid reduces this to a mere 95%. The only downside, I'd say.

As for the something-not-Monk, Druid/CoT/Barbarian sounds cool

Thanks for the suggestions.

I went back and forth quite a bit on which spell focus school to take. Conjuration for the reasons you listed above, and Necromancy for the Slay Living and Finger of Death. Had I not strapped myself for Feats, I would have taken both. I'm not sure why I ended up taking Necromancy, other than it seemed to end quite a few fights pretty quickly. I had thought about taking an epic spell focus, but in epic levels the spells rarely failed.

The Epic Energy Resistance was only taken because there wasn't much left from the Druid Bonus feat list. You could substitute an Epic Spell instead; perhaps Hellball or Greater Ruin (pity no Epic Warding).

For some reason, I was thinking that WF and EWF Unarmed Combat didn't work with the Druid's Shapes. I thought that someone had said that they showed up in the character sheet but didn't actually make it into the actual combat rolls. If I am incorrect, then yes, I would want to work those in.

Your right, Barbarian would fit nicely into the concept of a nature-worshipping Druid changing into a huge bear and attacking with tooth and claw. Plus the Uncanny Dodge would be nice too. I had toyed around with making the last two levels: Rogue (39) and CoT (40) for a Tumble and Discipline Point Dump, but in the end I decided to stay as pure Druid as possible as it seemed a little cheesy otherwise. Of course at that point I would probably just say "damn the torpedoes, I'm taking some Monk!!"

Anyway, thank you for the good suggestions. If anyone can confirm the WF, EWF Unarmed combat thing, I would appreciate it as I will need to adjust my feats.
Quote: dmuzzy
The Epic Energy Resistance was only taken because there wasn't much left from the Druid Bonus feat list. You could substitute an Epic Spell instead; perhaps Hellball or Greater Ruin (pity no Epic Warding).
Euh, I'd say the Epic Spell Focus is still better.

As for the (E)WF issue, Xylophone posted a Druid 28/Monk 10/SD 2 build not long ago, which had those feats and he had listed the ABs for each elemental form plus Dragon shape so I expect those feats do make a difference.

EDIT: the extremely high Wisdom isn't actually as good as it sounds like. I'm not sure if you thought about this but if you drop the Epic Energy Resistance for Epic Spell Focus: X and two Wisdom for Greater Spell Focus: Y you effectively gain +1 in X DCs and +3 in Y DCs while losing 1 point in others. Losing another two Wisdom you gain Epic Spell Focus in Y aswell, making X DCs the same they're now and Y DCs 4 points higher, and you gain an extra epic feat on top of that. Something to think about

at the moment:
X: 10 +Z +13 +4 = 27 +Z
Y: 10 +Z +13 = 23 +Z
other: 10 +Z +13 = 23 +Z

1st case:
X: 10 +Z +12 +6 = 28 +Z
Y: 10 +Z +12 +4 = 26 +Z
other: 10 +Z +12 = 22

2nd case:
X: 10 +Z +11 +6 = 27 +Z
Y: 10 +Z +11 +6 = 27 +Z
other: 10 +Z +11 = 21 +Z

Z is the spell level

plus one extra feat (EWF: Unarmed )
_________________
Surely, without war there would be no loss - hence, no mourning, no grief, no pain, no misery...

Edited By FinneousPJ on 12/12/05 15:46

Quote: Posted 12/12/05 15:14:36 (GMT) -- dmuzzy



I had thought about taking an epic spell focus, but in epic levels the spells rarely failed.

The Epic Energy Resistance was only taken because there wasn't much left from the Druid Bonus feat list. You could substitute an Epic Spell instead; perhaps Hellball or Greater Ruin (pity no Epic Warding).

I recently lvled an epic cleric in a mod and realized that epic spells are one of my last priorities. When you are tight on feats there are better choices than greater ruin/hellball/dragon knight which are anyhow usable just once/day.

Quote: 
For some reason, I was thinking that WF and EWF Unarmed Combat didn't work with the Druid's Shapes. I thought that someone had said that they showed up in the character sheet but didn't actually make it into the actual combat rolls. If I am incorrect, then yes, I would want to work those in.

Now WF/EWF work with druid unarmed shapes (they corrected it in a recent patch)...if I'm not mistaken IC too should work.

Quote: 
Of course at that point I would probably just say "damn the torpedoes, I'm taking some Monk!!"
Now you start sounding reasonable
Cheers,
Kail
_________________
Dilegua notte
Tramontate stelle
Tramontate stelle
All'alba vinceṛ
Vinceṛ
Vinceṛ
Quote: Posted 12/12/05 15:31:46 (GMT) -- FinneousPJ

Quote: dmuzzy
The Epic Energy Resistance was only taken because there wasn't much left from the Druid Bonus feat list. You could substitute an Epic Spell instead; perhaps Hellball or Greater Ruin (pity no Epic Warding).
Euh, I'd say the Epic Spell Focus is still better.

As for the (E)WF issue, Xylophone posted a Druid 28/Monk 10/SD 2 build not long ago, which had those feats and he had listed the ABs for each elemental form plus Dragon shape so I expect those feats do make a difference.

EDIT: the extremely high Wisdom isn't actually as good as it sounds like. I'm not sure if you thought about this but if you drop the Epic Energy Resistance for Epic Spell Focus: X and two Wisdom for Greater Spell Focus: Y you effectively gain +1 in X DCs and +3 in Y DCs while losing 1 point in others. Losing another two Wisdom you gain Epic Spell Focus in Y aswell, making X DCs the same they're now and Y DCs 4 points higher, and you gain an extra epic feat on top of that. Something to think about

at the moment:
X: 10 +Z +13 +4 = 27 +Z
Y: 10 +Z +13 = 23 +Z
other: 10 +Z +13 = 23 +Z

1st case:
X: 10 +Z +12 +6 = 28 +Z
Y: 10 +Z +12 +4 = 26 +Z
other: 10 +Z +12 = 22 +Z

2nd case:
X: 10 +Z +11 +6 = 27 +Z
Y: 10 +Z +11 +6 = 27 +Z
other: 10 +Z +11 = 21 +Z

Z is the spell level

plus one extra feat (EWF: Unarmed )

OOH-KAY, wrong button, excuse me
_________________
Surely, without war there would be no loss - hence, no mourning, no grief, no pain, no misery...

Edited By FinneousPJ on 12/12/05 16:08