The difference in damage is not enough to make up for the two extra attacks and the high crit range of the dual kukri (404-664 Greatsword vs. 450-756 2 Kukri, and that's without taking crits in account). Using a two-hander allows you to use a Full Plate, yes, but the build's idea is to deal damage, not tank with a plate. There are better builds for that (PM/Fighter comes to mind )
HP -- 26d10 Ranger 04d10 Fighter 10d06 Rogue -- 360 +2 * 40 CON +40 Toughness -- 480
One more time: you don't survive because of your HP, or AC. You survive because you KD them and they're dead by the end of the first turn Or if they're not, they've gotten some nasty STR drain from Crippling Strike and are easier to KD again,
Hide/Move Silently can be buffed to 69/52 without any items whatsoever. _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
Results from pulse cap's build searcher: The Banestalker /Ranger 30/Fighter 4/Rogue 6 by Cinnabar Din Sneaky Avenger /Rogue 13/Ranger 21/Fighter 6 by CrispyCritter Veteran Ranger /Ranger 23/Rogue 13/Fighter 4 by fernandooa Ranger 21/Fighter 6/Rogue 13 by Herbie Shimmer Protector of the Forest /Ranger 22/Fighter 4/Rogue 14 by MB52 The Cleaver (Ranger 32/Fighter 6/Rogue 2) by Mithdradates The Lone Ranger (Ranger 21/Fighter 16/Rogue 3) by Mithdradates
I'd like to note that the Panther companion is ideal for this build. Buff her with Greater Magic Fang and Cat's Grace for +7 AB/+5 damage and she'll rip the KD'd opponents with her 13d6 Sneak Attacks _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
Edited By FinneousPJ on 06/23/06 15:47
Skill Focus probably isn't as good for you as IKD would be. _________________ CATS!
Quote: Posted 06/23/06 19:50:26 (GMT) -- avarielo
Skill Focus probably isn't as good for you as IKD would be.
Not enough Intelligence. IKD is only novelty anyway, +4 on the disc check isn't earth shattering. _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
Edited By FinneousPJ on 06/23/06 19:57
You've got enough AB to make using the kukris worth it for the threat range - one of the few kukri builds I've seen that can boast such a thing.
I don't think skill focus does much for you either, but I'm not sure what else you could put there. Maybe Great Fortitude, since your fort save isn't hopeless like the other two are.
Nice damage-dealer build, teaming with a damage sponge type will make a good combo. _________________ Experience is the mother of good judgement; bad judgement is the father of experience.
I don't think skill focus does much for you either, but I'm not sure what else you could put there. Maybe Great Fortitude, since your fort save isn't hopeless like the other two are.
Yeah, I agree. My choices were Called Shot and the SF, but a save booster wouldn't hurt either, especially against Dev Crit. _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
Reporting from my experience of the Executioner, kukri is the way. And as you say, KD isn't even that necessary since you carve up anything fast anyway. A Dwarven Wall would get hurt even with the off-hand every blow in most settings.
I took the executioner up agianst three monsters in the Novice to Epic module, and had killed one of them when I died when using Greatsword. Dual-wielding kukri's was another story, it saw me victorious. Rangers is one of the build-types that really benefit from it when you have BoE. Good build. Bad saves.
And as you say, KD isn't even that necessary since you carve up anything fast anyway.
Yeah, when I'm attacking from stealth it's devastating, however it's good to have KD to get sneak attacks in at any given time. I was stating that IKD isn't all that useful (in PvP at least, save against Dragon shifters and the like). It's only a +4 for the Disc check DC, not exactly that great. _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
IKD also allows you to KD larger creatures (i.e. you could KD a giant), but it's by no means a must-have feat.
Nifty build though Finn.
*edit* You know, it may be worthwhile picking up Stealthy instead of the Skill Focus feat. That way you boost both Hide and Move (albeit, the boost is +2 instead of +3). Just a thought. _________________ This signature will self-destruct in 5 seconds...
Edited By Cinnabar Din on 06/23/06 22:41
Quote: Posted 06/23/06 22:36:13 (GMT) -- Cinnabar Din
IKD also allows you to KD larger creatures (i.e. you could KD a giant), but it's by no means a must-have feat.
True.
Thanks everyone! _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
WOW! First mith now Finn! ANd I thought all the good builds had been done years ago! jk
Finn, I really like this one! I have yet to play a ranger on a pw and this one I may try, if I can look past that 40% thingy!
Thanks for puttin this out there.
I like it. Insane amounts of damage are always good. Just a thought though, while I'm sure your getting sick of everyone mentioning skill focus, but did you consider taking improved initiative? With regular initiative and that AC, you better just hope that roll better then them.
Also, why did you take blind-fight? It's a good feat, but without being an assassin casting darkness everywhere, it seems that it's just a precaution that could easily become a moot point.
Oh, and regarding your HP, 480 isn't that low...
Edited By Big Meph on 06/23/06 23:39
Quote: Posted 06/23/06 23:37:08 (GMT) -- Big Meph
Also, why did you take blind-fight? It's a good feat, but without being an assassin casting darkness everywhere, it seems that it's just a precaution that could easily become a moot point.
Everyone who plans on dealing damage with physical attacks rather than spells should take Blind Fight. Way, way too many wizards/sorcerers/bards/clerics/people with UMD running around with Improved Invisibility all the time.
NPC spellcasters routinely buff themselves with improved invisibility, let alone PC spellcasters, spellswords, battle clerics, and UMDers. Blind fight is arguably even more important to a melee or archer than weapon focus is. _________________ Experience is the mother of good judgement; bad judgement is the father of experience.
I understand it's use, I'm merely saying that against someone who isn't invisible/concealed, it is merely decoration on a very bulky cake.
Quote: Posted 06/24/06 01:15:03 (GMT) -- Big Meph
I understand it's use, I'm merely saying that against someone who isn't invisible/concealed, it is merely decoration on a very bulky cake.
He?
Yeah, and IC is a total waste on all crit immune enemies. Of course he needs blindfight, but yeah, of course he doesn't need it when fighting non-concealed enemies....
I really didn't get your point at all, soory for being lost.... _________________ Dragonlance ROH is back, better than before! and I spend a little time here WoG
Quote: Posted 06/24/06 01:15:03 (GMT) -- Big Meph
I understand it's use, I'm merely saying that against someone who isn't invisible/concealed, it is merely decoration on a very bulky cake.
That's the point, though - it's not merely decoration because concealment is common enough even in PvE that blindfighting will be used regularly. Like, every time you fight an NPC with wizard, sorcerer, or bard levels. _________________ Experience is the mother of good judgement; bad judgement is the father of experience.
Or creatures with natural concealment (shadow fiends come to mind).
Blind Fight is well worth the feat investment, as I find throughout the course of the character's life, you'll run into a lot of opponents with concealment. _________________ This signature will self-destruct in 5 seconds...
It was just a SUGGESTION!!! I am not leading a crusade against anyone and everyone who uses blind-fight!
I never said thst it was a complete waste of a feat, on the contrary I actually said, and I quote "It's a good feat...".
And Grimnir, tell me, how often do you verse creatures/players vulnerable to criticals when compared to concealed/invisible ones?
Woah there Meph, we're not trying to give you a hard time. It's just that this statement you made (especially the bolded part):
Quote: Also, why did you take blind-fight? It's a good feat, but without being an assassin casting darkness everywhere, it seems that it's just a precaution that could easily become a moot point.
makes it look like you find Blind Fight to be of very limited utility (i.e. only if you're an Assassin using Darkness), but it's much more valuable than that. That's all. _________________ This signature will self-destruct in 5 seconds...
As a point in Blind-Fight, most Cleric builds (strong buffed meleers) use Improved Invisibility thanks to Trickery Domain, and those are the moments when you curse not taking Blind-Fight, as you get your puny *** kicked. All undead and constructs immune to sneaks and crits, but for concealed, PvP is a whole different story.
Just as a note... random 7 enemies for PvM sounds ridiculous, it's on my thinking that sneak and crit immune enemies should take the honor of recieving BoE.
Anyway, cool build, I like the damage and all, nasty foe, this one might deal enough damage to take my Arcane Wall V2 frontally (or else I'll brag about it), pretty good.
Couldn't you change DEX for INT to take IKD? just thinking, those 2 DEX allow you 1 INT... and it's 1 AC loss for IKD, which aint that bad.
Edited By Thaxll'ssyllia on 06/24/06 04:35
Quote: Posted 06/23/06 23:37:08 (GMT) -- Big Meph
I like it. Insane amounts of damage are always good. Just a thought though, while I'm sure your getting sick of everyone mentioning skill focus, but did you consider taking improved initiative? With regular initiative and that AC, you better just hope that roll better then them.
Actually I did consider taking Improved Initiative and Thug pre-epic, replacing SF and Toughness. That's not a bad suggestion.
Quote: Posted 06/23/06 23:37:08 (GMT) -- Big Meph
Also, why did you take blind-fight? It's a good feat, but without being an assassin casting darkness everywhere, it seems that it's just a precaution that could easily become a moot point.
This point seems to have been discussed already...
It is actually, because his AC is so low even opponents with mediocre AB can expect to hit three or even four times per round unhasted. But that's why I like the suggestion that follows.
Couldn't you change DEX for INT to take IKD? just thinking, those 2 DEX allow you 1 INT... and it's 1 AC loss for IKD, which aint that bad.
Yeah, I should have seen that myself. I suppose that's more valuable than the SF, since you'll be wanting to hit that KD.
Cheers everyone _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
Edited By FinneousPJ on 06/24/06 10:40
Quote: Posted 06/24/06 03:36:48 (GMT) -- Big Meph
And Grimnir, tell me, how often do you verse creatures/players vulnerable to criticals when compared to concealed/invisible ones?
The frequency is not the point, the point I was trying to get forth is that many feats are wasted if you face opponents that are immune, or doesn't use the offense you defend against. I wrote He? because your point was lost onme. Of course you don't need BF when fighting non-concealed opponents, like IC vs crit-immunes KD vs immune to KD etc.... BF is actually a must-have feat for melee builds. In itself much more valuable than say, Epic Prowess. Oh, and you will be up against Concealed players a lot in PvP.
Just as a note... random 7 enemies for PvM sounds ridiculous, it's on my thinking that sneak and crit immune enemies should take the honor of recieving BoE.
I see you're not used to STR-rangers. You don't pick sneak/crit immune enemies just because of that. You can hurt those just nice anyhow. You pick monsters you know you will be up against a lot. Though undeads often fall into this category, constructs may not. _________________ Dragonlance ROH is back, better than before! and I spend a little time here WoG
I see you're not used to STR-rangers. You don't pick sneak/crit immune enemies just because of that. You can hurt those just nice anyhow. You pick monsters you know you will be up against a lot. Though undeads often fall into this category, constructs may not.
Exactly. That's why I said "random"; it's up to your own taste. _________________ "We keep our Feast of Feasts, sure of our bourne, Our aims self-same: The Guest of Guests, friend Zarathustra, came! The world now laughs, the grisly veil was torn, And Light and Dark were one that wedding-morn."
Edited By FinneousPJ on 06/24/06 12:44
Quote: Posted 06/24/06 12:12:16 (GMT) -- Grimnir77 I wrote He? because your point was lost onme.
Oh... I see. You meant an expression like heh? huh? or wha?
I thought you meant He as in He/She, as though I'd improperly labelled someone or something as a male.
You should be able to add the Sneak Attack damage against most foes with your high AB KD.
Or if they're not, they've gotten some nasty STR drain from Crippling Strike and are easier to KD again, 
I am not leading a crusade against anyone and everyone who uses blind-fight!
Woah there Meph, we're not trying to give you a hard time. It's just that this statement you made (especially the bolded part):