If you haven't seen it yet, this is where the inspiration for this build came from ( Click Here ). Thanks Finn, I thought my creative building days were done (I think I've been here for a few years now.. an OLD fart I am ).
I did a search and came up with only 3 builds that use this combo, which I found very surprising. And it was a very nice surprise to be in the company of 3 players whom I have respected for some time (in aplhy order)
1) Finn's Dex Paladin ( Click Here )
2) Ithcan's Avenging Commando ( Click Here )
3) Mith's Fearless Cavalier ( Click Here ).
I also found my idea totally unique, which was a huge treat.
Basically, a semi-discussion began in a post about the rp of a rogue/paladin. In my view, I found the 2 classes to be extremely easy to rp. Then Finn put out the dnd class test and I came back with Paladin/thief! TWICE! So I put pen to paper (yes I dont use the tools either).
The first thing I had to look at, if I were a paladin/thief LG, what would I be more of? It turns out after some soul searching (I was away from my pc for about a week ) it turns out I am more roguish than paladin, though I do have my moments
I chose to use fighter as my 3rd class for the damage bonus and the feats. I was thinkin of cot, but in the, fighter! This meant I couldn't have xp penalties! I HATE xp penalties! HATE them. So I was left with this lvl split f6 / p6 / r28 (for the bonus feat).
The name, despite what I have teased about in other posts as of late, is from the personality test! Yes, my character is a follower of Tyr *sigh* Oh well..
The devastating thud comes from the weapon choice : warhammer!! I went dev crit with this cuz I thought it would be so cool to see a dude get hit with a warhammer so hard that he simply fell over, dead, or better yet, EXPLODE
The end result was a very surprising winner! I actually got a semi decent ab (41 with mundane hammer). With ikd we can get some nice sneak damage (18d6 if I recall correctly). Then theres always that roll of 1 to get exploded (I hate the 19-20 crit on warhammers lol).
The lows are the AC! Even with a high tumble (42ish/ 41 effective) you get only 17 nekid and 28 with mundane gear. I guess you could use UMD to cast cat's, but I dont count that as a bonus cuz every roguish char should use that, which doesnt make mine special.
The saves are weaker than Id like, but they can be twinked with cha gear or uni save gear, so not too bad really.
All points taken, this is really a one trick pony. Go in, try to KD or sneak the target then hit them hard! Since I have taken pal with it, NO OL's or disarm traps etc. thats simply too non-lawful for a paladin! Of course, what you decide to put on your character sheet is up to you.
One last note on the progression, I took rogue in blocks of 4 for the pre lvls. I did this to ensure that I'd get the full AB of the lvl split. If I were to play the build, where I personally wouldnt care if I missed one ab or something, I'd take fighter at lv 2 to let me use the hammer earlier. That's all I really see with this guy.
Without further fanfare.. (no story i know.. I'll leave that up to Tyr), here he is.
Tyr's Devastating Thud (Figher 6 - Paladin 6 - Rogue 28) Playable PvM (as indicated) Race Human Alignment Lawful Good
Skills important ones : discipline, concentration, tumble, umd (32 or so), taunt, spellcraft (21 cc)
because of the many rogue lvls you have lots of skills to choose: you can take listen or spot or whatever else you desire
HP 368 max
AC 17 naked/ 28 with mundane fp + tower (pathetic actually!!)
AB 41/36/31/26 or 27 bab
Saves Fort 24 Ref 20 Will 16
I just had a thought. Please do not think that you can add points to ms or hide and get away with it! I'm sure you could do that, and get the skills high enough to hide in full plate, but DONT! It is sooo wrong! This guy is all about in your face bashing. He will need str itms and con itms with nice AC boosts too.
Feel free to add any of your thoughts or suggestions.
Touched up the format - Kail Pendragon
Edited By Kail Pendragon on 07/08/06 10:00
Leave it up to me, will ya? (cute, but so true *IF* I likes the build and/or the ocncept (or, er, gets a clearly called upon to comment (and actually know somethin' about it to make a comment worthwhile
There are a few pally-rogues out there all of a sudden, including mine (Medieval Scout (but COT instead of FTR), + Meph's and Finn's, of course, and wasn't aware he did one with FTR too, but no matter, the concept is JUST SO COOL (like, by yer count, that makes all of 6 builds in the field (and, thus, so TERRIBLY overlooked! So, GOOD FER YOU! Nice addition to the pally-rog. bank
Kinda tired right now to do yer build justice, but promise, will take a looksy proper tomorrow; on a first hand look though, nice, Av. Love the concept, and seems you've some very very cool and doable feats; a dev crit pally rogue, with quite decent AB (41 fer a sneaker type build?! Nice and other neat tricks up yer sleeve: like I said, will give ya "proper praise" (and the look-over yer cool build is due) tommorrow
On first glance, though, looks pretty darn neat (other than the HP/AC issue, as you don't seem to go fer ED -(ah, but you're a sales guy, shoot from the hip, decent roguish AB, very nice UMD, and thus first outta the gate, yes> is just "so" you!
Nice, Av; but, really, will check it all out proper tomorrow - promise. So, see ya tomorrow, and in the meantime, Thud on! ~ Tyr (with blessings, oh disciple of mine.er our god, too
Edited By TyrTemplar on 07/07/06 10:04
I'll take a better lookm later, but it seems quite fun for PvM. You only spend 29 ability points at first, put the last in CON, in case you use those potions. Higher chance of 1 more. _________________ Dragonlance ROH is back, better than before! and I spend a little time here WoG
OMG! It was the FIRST time I used word to format out my build (usually I just typed it out in the silly little bioware message box!) and look what happens! Thanks for the catch Grim. I had actually added the point to wis9! But your suggestion is even better!
Quote: Posted 07/07/06 04:39:43 (GMT) -- avado
One last note on the progression, I took rogue in blocks of 4 for the pre lvls. I did this to ensure that I'd get the full AB of the lvl split. If I were to play the build, where I personally wouldnt care if I missed one ab or something, I'd take fighter at lv 2 to let me use the hammer earlier. That's all I really see with this guy.
There is no reason not to move fighter to level 2. BAB will not change if you switch it's position with rogue levels 2, 3 or 4. Not at the total level, or even as you level up. _________________ Him? That can't be William Wallace. I'm prettier than this man.
Edited By Highlander44 on 07/07/06 16:32
Hey, AV: as promised
A str-based pally-rogue, not a sneaker, - great concept and very neat build; UMD is nice, pretty much full access, ie., great buffs and stuff, includin' true strike! That havin' been said, and notwithstanding, your "sheriff-type" character deserves some more HPs -- b/c your unbuffed AB is very decent, and 'cause you got UMD access (& can buff just about everything I'd actually be inclined to drop two great strengths in favor of epic toughness, cost: -1 AB & a wee bit of phys. damage (or, 40 unbuffed & still decent, now add all yer buffs but the HPs, this would bring ya up to the so-called "magical line"!
Add to this all those great skills, lots of utility, etc., very cool (Oh, and take ftr for earlier weapon for more playability; I think Highlander's right on that, it shouldn't hurt ya -- either way, nice, AV!
Yep, you built the Sheriff - stand tall at high noon, 20 paces and draw....(very nice twist - I likes it!) ~ Tyr
Edited By TyrTemplar on 07/07/06 21:13
Quote: Posted 07/07/06 04:39:43 (GMT) -- avado ... STR 17 (30) DEX 8 CON 12 WIS 8 INT 14 CHA 14 ...
the attribute points don't add up. you are missing one point which can be allocated. or did i miscalculate?
the attribute points don't add up. you are missing one point which can be allocated. or did i miscalculate?
-cs
Grimnir already said that, BTW _________________ "With Europe liberated, the people of the world turned their attention to that old devil, the United States of America [...] We taught that monster of old the true meaning of freedom." Star Wreck
Quote: Posted 07/07/06 20:59:07 (GMT) -- TyrTemplar I'd actually be inclined to drop two great strengths in favor of epic toughness, cost: -1 AB & a wee bit of phys. damage (or, 40 unbuffed & still decent, now add all yer buffs but the HPs, this would bring ya up to the so-called "magical line"! ~ Tyr
That would have to be the last two GrSTR's. That would also decrease his Dev-DC by 1. But if he wants those hp's, Epic Toughness is a poor choice. Dropping two GrSTR for Toughnes and Great CON and then start with 1 higher con at creation(has a point unspent) Would give him 80 hitpoints AND +1 fort save. Instead of just +40 hitpoints.
Taking fighter at lvl 2 is sound advice though. Adds up your feats faster in the beginning, and gets you armour/Weapon prof earlier. _________________ Dragonlance ROH is back, better than before! and I spend a little time here WoG
DevCrit factor, indeed; no, don't wanna do that if he's got an extra stat point unspent! Hence, should KEEP STR where it is. Instead, maybe drop 1 cha (only needs 13 for Pally and divine, as I recall) or, alternatively, Int (rogues get so many skills to begin with, that, well, just an alternative option); either way, add this point to Con with that other (unspent) one, for the extra HPs and +1 fort boost, leavin' his Str and dev.crit factor exactly where it is - yes, that makes much, much more sense! (nice catch, Grim - as usual
Edited By TyrTemplar on 07/08/06 04:55
Quote: Posted 07/07/06 04:39:43 (GMT) -- avado
One last note on the progression, I took rogue in blocks of 4 for the pre lvls. I did this to ensure that I'd get the full AB of the lvl split. If I were to play the build, where I personally wouldnt care if I missed one ab or something, I'd take fighter at lv 2 to let me use the hammer earlier. That's all I really see with this guy.
STR 17 (30) DEX 8 CON 12 WIS 8 INT 14 CHA 14
Leveling 01 Rog 1 Power Attack, Toughness 02 Rog 2
Thanks for all the suggestions. I was sure that I made the build with ftr at lv 2! Or a suggestion of it. I was even positive that I wouldnt loose anything AB wise. I just had flashbacks from some years ago about a poster who got ripped apart for NOT puttin his 3/4 classes all bunched together It was reallly a traumatic moment for those who witnessed it! So much so that years later, I posted the build with all my 3/4 lvls together so I too would not run the risk of such malicious posting! And yet, it still occurs! Who can you please!!!
Oh, I like the 13 con thing! I was drinkin ALOT (I AM CANADIAN!!) when I did the original DRAFT. Thanks Grim for pointin out my miss calc (if ONLY a mod would add the point to the original post so that it would read correctly).
Oh, TOUGHNESS I like! That's feat I almost wasnt goin to consider. Alas, I snuck it in there under all noses. SO, I am beginnng to rethink my stratagy! You can do sneak attacks in full plate! It just takes a VERY Lawful GOOD sneaker to do it! So, for those who want to know HOW I did it, read that I have added 42 skills to Hide AND MoveSilent, while at the same time I took Human, subrace:sneakybuggers which gives a +35 to each skill! With the dex penalty and armor AND Tower shield AND massive hammer, I am still able to sneak up on all those sitting ducks who are enjoying the great view of the country side, here in canada....
WOW! What a rant! I appreciate all the help, and I must say that of all the builds I have done, this was the most enjoyable...
In closing, its not a good thing to DRINK and build nwn characters.... too many mishaps. _________________
This post is for general information purposes only, and does not constitute a legal opinion or render any legal advice. It may not be relied on for any purpose, and gives rise to
PM me or one of the other moderators the changes you want in the leveling guide so that we can edit them in.
Cheers, Kail _________________ To hear the sound of Freedom, many gave their lives They fought for you and me Those memories will always live inside us, and now it's our time to be free
Nice goings avado.
Odd weapon for a Dev Critter... your weapon's critical threat range is the lowest possible...
Not bad suggestion to go for more HP TyrTemplar, although 2 Great Constitutions are always better than 2 Epic Toughness (same HP in a level 40 build, +1 Fort save with CON). I'd keep AB as high as possible (and he took Toughness already), this is a guy that uses IKD a lot.
Odd weapon for a Dev Critter... your weapon's critical threat range is the lowest possible...
Yes, I figured scrimter, but I took hammer cuz that's what the personality test wanted! See, in the beginning, it was gonna be a "name" build. You know, take what the personality test gave and turn it to a build. The problem was, I like to twink my builds... so in the end, I altered the original idea. I kept the hammer cuz it makes such a pretty picture in my mind of a huge hammer exploding something in one hit! No, to answer the critics, I had a wonderful childhood. _________________
I think avado answered your question like no other could...
I think the hammer is cool _________________ "With Europe liberated, the people of the world turned their attention to that old devil, the United States of America [...] We taught that monster of old the true meaning of freedom." Star Wreck
).
) it turns out I am more roguish than paladin, though I do have my moments 
*sigh* Oh well.. 
It was the FIRST time I used word to format out my build (usually I just typed it out in the silly little bioware message box!) and look what happens! Thanks for the catch Grim. I had actually added the point to wis9! But your suggestion is even better!
but the HPs, this would bring ya up to the so-called "magical line"! 