Note that the following statistics are all based on "naked" and unbuffed characters and do not include the +1 AC from Dodge Feat for those shapes that have it (Rakshasa, Drow Warrior and Kobold Commander). Additionally, the values listed for the saving throws are the raw values (i.e. vs. traps) and DO NOT include the bonuses, which are listed in the following line; thus the Saving Throws vs. Spells while in human form would be 34/41/30 (F/W/R) and while in dragon form would be 45/41/43.
I recently "discovered" the fun of playing a druid/shifter character after reading about a proposed build on one of the Yahoo Groups. Admittedly, I've NEVER played a druid in my life -- never had a strong desire to play a character class, which I felt was weak and limited to outdoor settings. In the days of PnP, I preferred rogues and wizards for their vast skills or power. With the advent of Baldur's Gate and then Neverwinter Nights, my interests shifted to melee types with the occasional rogue, mainly because the spell casters were too difficult to play (had to navigate through too many menus to cast a spell) and operating a rogue in stealth mode was too slow to maintain my interests. Thus when I saw the opportunity to try a spell caster, which could change into numerous shapes to meet the various challenges as they presented themselves, I was captivated. Race and Attributes. As the class attribute bonuses don't carry over to shifted forms there is little to be gained by selecting anything other than human for a shifter. The extra feat, additional skill point per level and ease of multi-classing is tough to beat. [Although there is a reported bug that even humans are penalized 20% XP if they take a third class.] WIS is the most important ability score for gaining access to the epic shapes, thus there is no reason to not max this to 18 at the start. STR/DEX/CON are frequently overridden while in shifted form (and generally are not important in the cases where they are not overidden); however, I do not like penalties where I can avoid them, so I set all these to 10. Although CHA really isn't necessary for this build, I opted to set it to 10 to prevent a penalty -- as well as avoid the crude comments found in many of the mods. Finally the remaining six points were assigned to INT to gain an additional two skill points per level. As I perceived my character operating mainly in shifted form after buffing up with the druid spells, I was convinced that taking at least one level of monk to capitalize on the AC boost from Wisdom as well as the numerous unarmed combat benefits would be hard to beat; thus my three classes would be druid/shifter/monk. (I know that there are those who are put off by "monk multiclasses"; however, the NWN rules allow this, so why not use it?) I also wanted to get the epic shifter shapes as soon as possible, particularly the Undead Shapes (first available at level 21) and the Dragon Shapes (technically available at level 30, however, more realistic and playable at level 33). Thus I would need ten shifter levels pre epic. [I've read about a "bug" that allows taking epic shapes at shifter level 10 if it occurs at character level 21, however, I don't really like exploiting bugs if I can help it and it really doesn't benefit this build that much anyway.] To minimize the reduction in AB and Saving Throws, I settled for eight levels of druid and two levels of monk pre-epic; I took the monk levels at seven and seventeen as they were the break points for the AC boost from Tumble. I elected to maximize druid levels prior to starting on the shifter levels as I wanted to develop my animal companion to its fullest as quickly as possible and maximize my buff spells and their duration, however, by delaying the final druid level until character level 10, I was able to get 13 ranks in Spellcraft, thus gaining an extra +1 in saves vs. spells (adjusted Spellcraft rank = 15). As an aside, I chose the Panther as my animal companion because of its sneak attack bonus as well as it seems to be the best "all rounder" for the early going when your companion is often the best offensive weapon at your disposal. Post-epic, I desired access to the Undead Shape (particularly the Risen Lord) at level 21, access to 9th level druid spells [Dr(17)], access to the Dragon Shape [WIS 30] as soon as practical and maximized Discipline and Tumble skills (as well as Hide and Move Silently). I ended up taking two levels of druid at levels 22 and 23 to delay the bonus shifter feats at Shifter(13 & 16) until my Wisdom was high enough to support the Outsider and Construct shapes. This works well as the character gains access to the fifth level spells "Awaken" and "Owl's Insight" as well as the Druid Special Ability "Venom Immunity". The bonus shifter feat at Shifter(19) was used to gain Wisdom, which allows taking the Dragon Shape at level 33. The remaining two Monk levels were taken at level 32 to minimize disruption to the shifter levels and level 40 to maximize Discipline and Tumble. Feats: Alertness is required for the shifter class and really the only feat that is essential for this build. I elected Knockdown and Improved Knockdown, as I have been quite successful with them while shifted into the big and strong melee shapes (Bear, Minotaur, Golem, and Dragon). I've also had success against various opponents with high AB by using Expertise and Improved Expertise, particularly while in a form that utilizes a non-melee attack such as basilisk, harpy and even vampire or dragon. I like Blind Fight and it seems to work well for me and the 40 additional hit points from Toughness is always nice. I took Improved Critical: Unarmed Strike as most of the shifted forms are unarmed and can benefit from the boost. [Note: I've read that the Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike bonus does not carry over to the shifted form ... strange.] Of note, I didn't take Combat Casting, Extend Spell or Empower Spell. While these are certainly valid choices and may appeal to some players, I found that their limited use made them less desirable that the aforementioned feats. As most of my spell casting is used for buffs following a rest, and the fact that I've maximized Concentration throughout the build, the +4 to Concentration checks didn't seem worth expending a feat to get. Extend Spell is also quite good, particularly for the buffs, however, by taking eight levels of Druid, most of the "essential buffs" (Resist/Endure Elements, Bull's Strength, Bark Skin, Stone Skin) will last for eight hours, which seemed long enough for my purposes. The one spell that would really benefit from Extend Spell is the seventh level spell "Aura of Vitality", which is very nice for a group buff, however, as it comes so late in this build, I didn't really think that I wanted to expend a feat just for that and again, the aforementioned feats seemed more useful. Empowered Spell is awesome with the Rakshasa form as all its Ice Storms become empowered if you have memorized an Empowered Ice Storm -- in fact there is a build specifically based on this feature. However, again, it was my desire to select feats that would apply to most of the shapes rather than just a few, so I elected to omit that feat. Epic Feats were selected with the goal of gaining the epic shapes (Undead, Outsider, Construct and Dragon) as soon as possible and boosting Wisdom to gain access to those shapes. I chose Epic Skill Focus: Discipline in an attempt to reduce the chances of suffering from a Knockdown as this character's Armor Class will plummet if it is ever put on its back. I also took Epic Prowess as any bonus to AB is good. Armor Skin would also have been good substitute for either of these feats. Skills. I chose skills that benefited the character in its various forms. Concentration: Required to cast spells while engaged as well as resist Taunt. Discipline: Required to resist combat feats such as Knockdown. Hide / Move Silently: Stealth is always good. Spellcraft: The bonus to saving throws vs. spells makes this well worthwhile. Spot: Useful for all shapes without True Seeing and particularly useful for combating those pesky rogues while in undead or construct shapes (immune to Sneak Attack). With your high Wisdom, why not take advantage of this? Tumble: The bonus to AC makes this well worthwhile. Open Lock: Only two points expended (for one rank) as this skill is not available unless trained. The Kobold Commander actually has some ability in this area and by obtaining one rank and using lock pick tools and Dex buffs, you should be able to open a DC35 lock, which is the maximum for non-rogues and perhaps maintain your stealth -- nothing will blow your cover like bashing a locked door or chest! Lore: I generally assign ten points to this skill if I have them as the ability to ID things (particularly "junk") makes it a worthwhile skill. Furthermore, points assigned here will stack with other items such as potions and rings, which really helps in identifying the better stuff in a timely manner. Finally, there are the occasional "Lore" checks to decipher glyphs etc. that can benefit from this skill; a nice skill to have a few ranks in. Persuade: Like Lore, I generally assign five points to this skill if I have them mainly for the role playing aspect as well as the occasional extra quest/reward.
The tale of the Pirate's Cove
The small kobold entered the cleverly concealed crevice at the base of the seaside cliffs and deftly padded up the dimly lit, narrow, twisting passage, taking care to stay hidden within the shadows. Ahead, the passage opened into a small chamber lit by a small lantern. From within the chamber, the sounds of the pirate sentries drunken boasting could be heard as each recounted some past conquest in an effort to outdo the previous speaker's tale. As the braggadocios continued with their gleeful banter, and backslapping, the small kobold quietly slipped past them unnoticed and continued up the narrow passage beyond. The passage ended abruptly at a solid door fitted with a well-built lock, however, the kobold was prepared for this and after a quick inspection of the lock, selected a set of lock picks and moments later the door was open revealing a narrow spiral stairway made of stone leading up. Climbing the staircase, the kobold arrived at another door. This one was not locked, but as the kobold slowly pushed the massive door open, its hinges made a dreadful squealing sound and the two sentries stationed just inside the doorway turned toward the noise. Initially they perceived a small creature standing within the now ajar door; however, as their minds were registering this information, the creature seemed to meld into the nearby shadows before their very eyes revealing nothing but the open doorway. Both guards shook their heads and looked questioningly at each other; however, neither spoke a word as one of them simply closed the door, pausing to ensure that the latch was engaged. They both scanned the surrounding area in silence and seeing nothing returned to their positions on either side of the door, oblivious of the small creature making its way up the corridor before them. The corridor ended in a "tee" and the kobold scanned both left and right before selecting the left passage. After a bit, the corridor turned right and continued for another ten meters before ending in another door. Mindful of her last experience, the kobold carefully pushed the door open, relieved, as it smoothly swung open on its well-oiled hinges. A quick glance revealed that the room was occupied by a half-dozen humans attired in robes gathered around a massive stone block at the far end of the room. The kobold slipped into the room and carefully closed the door behind her before any would notice that it had been opened. As she turned to better assess the situation, she felt a chill run up her spine when she realized that despite her best efforts at concealment, one of the robed figures was looking directly at her position amongst the shadows -- from the intensity of his stare, she was certain that he could detect her presence, True Seeing perhaps? As the robed figure began the incantation of a spell, the kobold abandoned her concealment and as the other robed figures turned to see what their "brother" had seen, they caught a brief glimpse of a small creature as it morphed into a reptilian form with penetrating eyes; eyes that could freeze one's very soul.
Where moments before there had been six robed humans, now there were only two, standing among four stone statues "looking" in the direction of the door, which were a perfect likeness of their former comrades. The remaining two spell casters averted their eyes and prepared to unleash their wild magic in the direction of the hideous creature before them, however, as their spells materialized, the basilisk morphed again and their magic had no effect on the Rakshasa that was now standing where the basilisk had been before. Even as they contemplated this turn of events they were assaulted by chunks of ice and freezing cold; killing one and gravely injuring the other, who was quickly dispatched by the Rakshasa's fiery staff. The Rakshasa had no time to gloat over her good fortune as the door soon burst open and the room began to fill with pirates responding to the commotion of the earlier encounter, all intent on claiming the kill of this unwelcome visitor for themselves. However, as they closed in upon the Rakshasa it morphed again, this time into a skeletal form wielding a scythe, which quickly moved through their ranks using its whirlwind attack. Although the pirate's sneak attacks were ineffective, the large number of initial attackers landed several blows, inflicting heavy damage on the Risen Lord; and in spite of their much thinned ranks, the remaining pirates sensed a victory at hand and continued to press their attack. Once again the creature changed form and instead of a badly wounded Risen Lord, the pirates found themselves facing a vampire, whose mere gaze commanded their thoughts and soon they found themselves fighting one another. The vampire found her new form invigorating as she rapidly regenerated lost hit points, while continuing to use her Domination Gaze and avoiding most attacks with her improved expertise. After rejuvenating a bit, the vampire easily finished off the remaining attackers and returned to the business at hand. What she had come for would be found under the massive stone block that occupied the room, however, this block required the combined strength of several strong men just to move it. Undaunted, the vampire morphed again; this time into a large bear, which easily pushed the stone block aside, revealing a large ironbound chest concealed in a hollow within the floor. Without a second thought, the great bear hoisted the chest out of the crevice before morphing into a human, her birth-form. The human quickly transferred the contents of the chest into several bags of holding and then summoned Al'Gar, a black panther and her steadfast companion to her side. Together, the druid and panther quickly departed the now empty halls and descended the staircase. The drunken sentries never really knew what hit them as they were consumed by lightning called forth from within the cavern and the few remaining survivors were quickly dispatched by Al'Gar's sneak attacks. The druid and her panther silently exited the cavern and strolled onto the moonlit beach beneath the cliffs where they were greeted by a torrent of flaming arrows originating from a small frigate that had anchored in the cove near the entrance to the caverns. It seemed that the job was not yet finished after all.
As the panther sought cover from the barrage of fire, the druid smiled to herself as she welcomed the forthcoming battle. Unconstrained by the confines of the cavern, she could now freely morph into her favorite form and as the hail of arrows descended upon her, the druid became a huge, ancient red dragon and the arrows merely bounced off its scaly hide unnoticed. The once bold crew of the frigate quickly lost heart and cries of terror erupted from the decks as men scrambled to avoid facing the dragon, which now stood before them. The dragon reared its head and let loose with a blast of flame that incinerated all that would burn. The frigate was engulfed in flames, as was the majority of its crew. After several more blasts of fire from the dragon's maw, all movement on the frigate's decks ceased. The dragon watched as the burning hulk of the frigate slowly sank into the waters that finally quenched the flames. Al'Gar returned to his master's side as she reverted back to her "birth-form" and together they departed the area, blending into the night along the ocean surf. With a final glance at the debris strewn waters where the frigate had once been, the shifter thought that perhaps tomorrow she would come back as a Koa-Toa and discover what treasures remained on board the pirate's ship.
"Yesterday I couldn't even spell Rakshasa and today I was one!" -- Chameleon after relating her tale of the Pirate's Cove.
Edited By Kail Pendragon on 10/13/06 12:23
This class mixture is my favourite type of build to play. I have so many variations to this type of build. I tend to go for druid based types rather than shifter based though (that is due to preference). I can never find a fine balance between the two classes but I think you done well here. Only problem I see is the fact that your buffing spells will tend to be dispelled often. Saying that you have all the epic shifter forms that help compensate the loss. Well done.
Quote: Posted 10/11/06 18:01 (GMT) -- daostwald
[Although there is a reported bug that even humans are penalized 20% XP if they take a third class.]
This is no bug as far as I know. Humans do not count their highest level base class when calculating xp penalties, but otherwise xp penalties apply as normal.
Also, have you considered taking your 1st monk level earlier? It may be hard to level before you gain access to more powerful spells, so the extra unarmed capability of the monk might well help out.
That aside, it's good to see this kind of versatility in a build. Good work, and always great to see a story, even if I can't write them
Kurth
Edited By K U R T H on 10/11/06 22:09
KURTH,
Actually, when I first started testing this build, I took the initial Monk level at level 2 as I thought that the AC boost and unarmed combat feats would improve the character's chances of survival. However, I discovered that the character was actually quite a bit "stronger" by concentrating on druid levels; simultaneously increasing the spell base (and duration) and improving the combat value of the animal companion. One of the reasons for this is that the druid can wear armor, which more than compensates for the Wisdom AC boost by going without armor at the lower levels. As the druid doesn't get Wild Shape until level five, the unarmed combat feats were not really that useful earlier in the build. Thus, I found that the initial levels were pretty much my druid donning the best armor and wielding the best weapon available, buffing herself and her companion to the best of her ability, and providing a target while the panther did the majority of the damage with its sneak attacks.
After gaining access to the Wild Shapes, the monk level became much more useful and I found the druid spending a lot of time as a bear where the unarmed and unarmored benefits of the monk class made her a foe to be reckoned with (and the Panther continued to rack up sneak attack damage)! I actually feel that this is one of the strongest builds I've ever played at these lower levels, including the melee tanks.
Jehoshua -- I must agree, these shape changing builds are a lot of fun to play. So versatile, with their various forms, it seems that there are usually several forms available to meet most any challenge. Also, I really enjoyed opening a door to find myself surrounded by baddies, and unleashing a Call Lightening to soften them up -- often there would only be a couple left standing, which were then dispatched with ease! There are several offensive strikes available throughout the druid spells, which if cast at the beginning of a combat (before shifting into a melee form) really add excitement to playing this character. I can see where the resiliance of the buffs could be a problem (particularly in PvP) and I suspect that you take more druid levels to beef these up.
Thanks again for the comments. Dave
Thanks for the comments. Dave
Please research and list similar builds as per the posting rules (link in my sig)!
Druid 17/Shifter17/Monk 6 by CheesesLovesYou PW Shifter /Druid 17/Monk 6/Shifter 17 by Herbie Shimmer Dragon Lord /Druid 15/Monk 6/Shifter 19 by Jehoshua Zelle's Son /Epic Shifter /Druid 21/Shifter 17/Monk 2 by mistertrinity Morpheus (based on Zelle's) /Druid 22/Shifter 17/Monk 1 by Shen_Chuen Nature’s Faces - Zelle’s Epic Shifter /Druid 22/Shifter17/Monk 1 by ZelleQyllvan
Your shapes stats are off the mark in many cases btw, you ain't considering kobold's small size for example, nor dragon shape huge size and +6 claws or golem large size. The sheet lies big time, trust only the combat logs (and have it easy with combat debugging turned on).
This said, the class combo is a popular one although I'd split differently the lvls. Shifters are lot of fun to play, although they require lot of practice and knowledge of the shapes. I'm having a great time with mine right now, just owned Orcus (the Orcus, right) on the PW I play on
Cheers, Kail _________________ Epic Character Builds Posting Rules
Kail,
I must appologize for my ignorance, I really wanted to include links to Zelle's build as well as the Rakshasa build, however, I was unable to figure out how to do this. Also, I read your post concerning using the combat log and would really like to do this as well, however, again, I really don't know how to exploit this feature either.
Could you please point me in the right direction for getting instructions on how to do these two things?
Thanks, Dave
No worries.
Regarding formatting in general and putting links in: Formatting and using BBCode (it's actually easy to find, click "Forum" on the menu to the right in this same page, then chose "Forum FAQ")
About combat debugging:
when in a testing module or whatever you use to level up and test your chracters) type in in the talk line:
##DebugMode 1 then hit enter ##dm_enablecombatdebugging 1 and enter again
after each command you'll get a confirmation message from the system, saying the command was successful. Beware the commands are case sensitive so type exactly as I wrote it.
After you have so enabled combat debugging, when you fight an enemy the server messages while show a detailed breakdown of yours and your enemy(ies) AB and AC, listing the different sources of each. In short you get detailed combat logs. You still need a knowledge of where some boni come from since they stack (like WIS AC being natural AC stacking with Armor Skin which again is natural AC and so on) but overall it gives you right figures. PM me if you have any doubts/problems understanding something.
Thank you for reminding me I have to add some info about these two issues for newcomers that don't know how to use them, btw
Now about the shapes, what is missing are basically the size modifiers plus dragon claws (+6 weapons). Dragons are Huge, Golems, Drider, Slaad and probably Manticore (can't rememebr now) are Large, Kobold and Wyrmling are Small. Huge means -2 AB/-2 AC, Large -1 AB/-1 AC, Small +1 AB/+1 AC. Dragons get a further +6 AB from claws (but remember it still get a bite attack without this bonus, although it fires off in a not regular pattern with monk's attacking schedule). I haven't checked all the slightest details, try double checking the saves.
Cheers, Kail _________________
Quote: Posted 09/25/06 11:58:10 (GMT) by xitooner
I find its better to be flexible, THINK, and know your enemy.
Edited By Kail Pendragon on 10/12/06 01:00
Yep, dat sheet, I tells ya -- Kail, maybe you can bring out one of those clerics of yours and cast a prayer to the gaming gods or something, getting them to redesign the whole thing (or, if not, maybe make it disappear by turning it into mummy dust or something ) Ah, but back to the character at hand...
Dae -- this looks good; with all that wisdom, plus the monk you've got goin' on, must say: looks like it'd be a ton of fun (and strong, too).
Nice story, too, btw. Very enjoyable ~ Tyr
Edited By TyrTemplar on 10/12/06 06:05
Tyr -- thanks for the comments, and yes, this is probably the most fun build I've ever played -- so many options.
FWIW: I've gone back and spent a lot of time with the combat log assessment, including developing a mini-arena of my own to help sort out the numbers. With the noted exception of the minor differences in AB and AC due to creature size (and possibly some transposition errors on my part as I had initially recorded the Saves in F/R/W order), I really didn't see anything different between the character sheet and the combat log. Perhaps I'm just not understanding what is to be reported in the Saving Throws. The saves as listed are the "raw" numbers (i.e. vs. trap) and do not include any bonuses vs. spells (generally +8 for this build), etc. As the bonuses are listed separately following the saves, I assumed that the reported saves did not include them (which is what the character sheet reports). Have I gotten this right?
Thanks, Dave
Your saves are probably right, I just didn't check them out because of lack of time. IIRC the sheet doesn't lie about the saves and anyhow you rechecked thme, so I assume they are the right figuress. Sorry if I was not clear enough
BTW, for character testing you might want to check out one of the leveling modules in the Useful Links thread (check my sig).
Shifters are lotsa fun indeed, I've yet to post my Loki build, but I'm stuck with the intro story.
Humans do not count their highest level base class when calculating xp penalties, but otherwise xp penalties apply as normal.
) Ah, but back to the character at hand...