Ok so this is my first posting of a build here so be nice. The original idea was from R.A. Salvatore's books about Drizzt Do'Urden, whom becomes physically involved with a human (Catti-Brie) and what there hypothetical child would by like if raised by and trained to fight by wulfgar(barbarian) and his mother (fighter-bow specialist) and not his/her father. After so many builds (I can't count the amount, I deleted 86 builds yesterday, or the day before and most were some type of version of this) I figured I would post one of the more balanced one's. I do know that this isn't the most uber build but no one (to my knowledge) has posted a build with this combination (hopefully someone will outdo this one).
Build Name: Overwhelming Thunder (Do'Urden Kin) Gender: Builder preference Race: Half Elf Alignment: Anything non-lawful Play Mode: PVM or Party Play
BRB(21)/SOR(1)/AA(18)
stats starting/ending str 16 / 25 dex 13 / 14 con 16 wis 08 int 13 cha 08
naked ac 18 while raging 16 w/mundane plate and tower shield ac 28 w/mundane plate and tower shield and raging ac 26 w/mundane plate and bow ac 25 w/mundane plate and bow and raging ac 23
hp 442 raging 562 (not maxed unsure what it would be)
bab:29 ab unarmed: 37/32/27/22 ab unarmed raging: 40/35/30/25 ab W/ mundane L.B.: 41/36/31/26 (doesn't change in rage) ab raging w/ mundane B.A.: 40/35/30/25
Quick Pros: Overhelming criticals at range and melee. Thundering rage
Total Skill Placement 213 points concentration(co) +10 (13) discipline(di) +39 (46) heal(he) +1 (0) hide(hi) +20 (22) intimidate(in) +39 (38) listen(li) +22 (22) move silently(ms) +20 (22) spot(sp) +22 (22) tumble(tu) +20 (22) *note Hide and listen can be taken to 40 instead of using move silently and spot. _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
Unfortunately, Overwhelming Critical and Massive Crits (including the bonus from thundering) do not stack. The deafness should still work, though. _________________ "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices, but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence" - Albert Einstein
Quote: Posted 07/07/07 02:12 (GMT) -- Dracolich92
Unfortunately, Overwhelming Critical and Massive Crits (including the bonus from thundering) do not stack. The deafness should still work, though.
wrong _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
I've tested it, they do indeed stack. I think the problem is that Devastating Critical has an issue with Thundering Rage's OnHit in that I think Dev Crit overrides it. (Similar to the issues Enserric gives you if you try to use one of his weapons + dev crit). You will note if you turn combat debugging on, that Overwealming critical is included in base weapon damage, whereas Massive Critical effects are a seperate beats.
Now, then... Why so much barbarian? I feel like Arcane Arche would give you so very much more. Barbrian 16/Sorceror 1/AA 23 would seem a more reasonable split. You lose 1/- DR and 1 use per day of rage (plus 20 HP, I suppose) for +3 Attack/Damage with a bow and a bonus feat. It seems like a good trade off, unless there's something I am missing.
Quote: Posted 07/07/07 11:36 (GMT) -- Ariel Thomas Now, then... Why so much barbarian?
For thundering rage only.
Quote: I feel like Arcane Arche would give you so very much more. Barbrian 16/Sorceror 1/AA 23 would seem a more reasonable split. You lose 1/- DR and 1 use per day of rage (plus 20 HP, I suppose) for +3 Attack/Damage with a bow and a bonus feat. It seems like a good trade off, unless there's something I am missing.
No your not missing much. It is a better split (unless your going for the barbarian feats) but I can't get Thundering rage with only 16 lvl's or can I? Isn't it a barbarian epic feat? If not (only 16 lvls) the build can easily be altered to another lvl split. seeing as ...
Quote: Posted 07/07/07 01:53 (GMT) -- sbtedarknight After so many builds (I can't count the amount, ... ... most were some type of version of this)
I still have a couple unfinished (skills and stats missing) ones laying around that I could fiddle with still.
Either way I hope to get more attention/help than I got in the general forum. (Yes mod's I know this doesn't mean post anything )
Anyways, Thank you for time and response. It is appreciated. _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
Edited By sbtedarknight on 07/07/07 15:35
The only pre-reqs for Thundering rage are 15 levels in Barbarian (Greater Rage), being an epic character, and 25 STR. You do not have to be and epic barbarian to qualify. This is similar to how Terrifying Rage works.
Quote: Posted 07/07/07 18:20 (GMT) -- Ariel Thomas The only pre-reqs for Thundering rage are 15 levels in Barbarian (Greater Rage), being an epic character, and 25 STR. You do not have to be and epic barbarian to qualify. This is similar to how Terrifying Rage works.
You're right I'll do a rebuild later .
Again, Thank You _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
To make the build more uber, look at not taking pre epic feats in epic slots... that way you can get some useful feats for the build.
Quote: Posted 07/08/07 01:57 (GMT) -- avado To make the build more uber, look at not taking pre epic feats in epic slots... that way you can get some useful feats for the build.
You're right kinda. This build has very low ac so ap:heavy needs to stay. almost all the rest are pre-req feats except rapid shot and blind fight. Then between those 2 I wouldn't drop rapid shot as any decent archer should have it, so that leaves blind fight which can be dropped. So i'll incorporate this into the rebuild later tonight or tomorrow ( depends on my kids ). And we'll see what happen's. _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
Edited By sbtedarknight on 07/09/07 01:28
Quote: Gender: Builder preference
Nice extra, we always forget to add gender to our build layouts
You've got 8 CHA and 13 INT so why the heck are you a Sorcerer and not a Wizard? at least you could cast True Strike as a Wizard but with 8 CHA and Sorcerer you can't cast anything at all, even though little, something is always better than nothing.
Why aren't you taking Devastating Critical? I'm puzzled about it; taking Overwhelming Critical without Devastating Critical is just a big waste of feats for a comparatively low extra amount of damage, you'd go better with Weapon Focus for your Battle Axe + Epic Weapon Focus on both weapons and 2 Great STR or Great DEX instead of Power Attack + Cleave + Great Cleave + 2*Overwhelming Critical. Hitting the enemy is far more important than extra damage from criticals... or else take Devastating Critical on both weapons instead of Armor Skin and Epic Prowess, that would also work fine. _________________
Quote: Posted 12/19/06 19:54 (GMT) -- FinneousPJ
Thax the Shadow Dragon sez: MONKS USE KAMAS. Just ask him.
Nice extra, we always forget to add gender to our build layouts
I thought someone might get a kick out of it.
Quote: You've got 8 CHA and 13 INT so why the heck are you a Sorcerer and not a Wizard?
Build concept.
Quote: at least you could cast True Strike as a Wizard but with 8 CHA and Sorcerer you can't cast anything at all, even though little, something is always better than nothing.
I know, i'm trying to work the charisma back up in my rebuild for some spells. The low cha started with me just seeing if it (getting A.A.) would work with only 8.
Quote: Why aren't you taking Devastating Critical? I'm puzzled about it; taking Overwhelming Critical without Devastating Critical
Quote: or else take Devastating Critical on both weapons instead of Armor Skin and Epic Prowess, that would also work fine.
I was under the impression that dev. crit. doesn't stack with thundering rage (or thundering rage doesn't stack with dev. crit, whatever), but I know that overwhelming crit. does stack with it.
Quote: is just a big waste of feats for a comparatively low extra amount of damage, you'd go better with Weapon Focus for your Battle Axe + Epic Weapon Focus on both weapons and 2 Great STR or Great DEX instead of Power Attack + Cleave + Great Cleave + 2*Overwhelming Critical. Hitting the enemy is far more important than extra damage from criticals...
This advice is being noted.
And Thank You for your reply. _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
I was under the impression that dev. crit. doesn't stack with thundering rage (or thundering rage doesn't stack with dev. crit, whatever), but I know that overwhelming crit. does stack with it.
I just don't see the logic in this. _________________ " -- They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more."
I was under the impression that dev. crit. doesn't stack with thundering rage (or thundering rage doesn't stack with dev. crit, whatever), but I know that overwhelming crit. does stack with it.
I just don't see the logic in this.
Which part ? I know that overwhelming does stack. But have been unable to verify if devastating does or not (do you know?). _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
Edited By sbtedarknight on 07/09/07 10:40
Quote: Posted 07/09/07 10:27 (GMT) -- sbtedarknight But have been unable to verify if devastating does or not (do you know?).
It's early and I'm not going to research it right now, but I'm 99% sure that Devastating Criticals will override the Thundering Rage feat. And believe me, Deavastating Criticals is far better.
Again, it's early, so I may be posting nonsense.
Edit: By override, I mean it will do such if they do not stack - I'm not even sure if they stack or not (I hate Barbarians).
-- Also, on the PvP server BoW, I know the two do stack. Though, it could be changed with scripting or something, so it may not stack for you.
I was under the impression that dev. crit. doesn't stack with thundering rage (or thundering rage doesn't stack with dev. crit, whatever), but I know that overwhelming crit. does stack with it.
I just don't see the logic in this.
Which part ? I know that overwhelming does stack. But have been unable to verify if devastating does or not (do you know?).
I believe it is how you wrote it, if they don't stack they don't stack and period, it doesn't work for one side or for the other, stacking is the addition of several effects of the same type, so they add or they don't, it's illogical to point it to either side, when something doesn't stacks the higher value is the one that remains. On another case one could override the other, since when overriding one is cancelled by the other and that might make a little sense. Devastating Critical and Thundering Rage have completely different effects, why wouldn't they "stack"?
Even if they wouldn't "stack", Devastating Critical effect beats Thundering Rage by far, I mean, what can work better than instant kill? nothing does, well, there's the thing that you need to roll a save against it and might not always work but still...
I'll never understand the concept difference between Sorcerer and Wizard, my mind only thinks in efficiency, and heck what difference can it possibly be between an arcane caster and another arcane caster? (especially with just one level) I'm so confused. _________________
Quote: Posted 12/19/06 19:54 (GMT) -- FinneousPJ
Thax the Shadow Dragon sez: MONKS USE KAMAS. Just ask him.
Edited By Thaxll'ssyllia on 07/09/07 20:18
correct me if i'm wrong, but...
Quote: Posted at NWNWiki
To qualify as an arcane archer, a character must fulfill all of the following criteria:
Base Attack Bonus: +6
Feats: Weapon Focus (Longbow or Shortbow), Point Blank Shot
Race: Elf or Half-Elf
Spellcasting: Ability to cast Arcane spells (Bard, Sorcerer, or Wizard classes)
one level in sorcerer, with 08 charisma, won't give you any spell-casting abilities. I remember making this mistake myself, when SoU came out...
so the build on the last page won't work! (it will if you change sorc to wiz tho)
Edited By eltrentoro on 07/09/07 20:54
You don't have to be able to cast arcane spells; you only need a single level in an arcane casting class. Not the way it's supposed to work as per the PnP rules, but that's how it works in NWN. _________________ It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!!
Quote: Posted 07/09/07 19:58 (GMT) -- Thaxll'ssyllia I believe it is how you wrote it
O ok .
Quote: Even if they wouldn't "stack", Devastating Critical effect beats Thundering Rage by far, I mean, what can work better than instant kill?
Um nothing.
Quote: I'll never understand the concept difference between Sorcerer and Wizard
well the concept was a half elf (drow) and drow have innate magical powers so sorcerer it was. (also no one had a similar build )
Quote: my mind only thinks in efficiency, and heck what difference can it possibly be between an arcane caster and another arcane caster? (especially with just one level) I'm so confused.
sorry.
Quote: Posted 07/09/07 20:50 (GMT) -- eltrentoro
correct me if i'm wrong, but... one level in sorcerer, with 08 charisma, won't give you any spell-casting abilities. I remember making this mistake myself, when SoU came out...
so the build on the last page won't work! (it will if you change sorc to wiz tho)
It does work.(not casting any spells though )
Quote: Posted 07/09/07 20:57 (GMT) -- Cinnabar Din
You don't have to be able to cast arcane spells; you only need a single level in an arcane casting class. Not the way it's supposed to work as per the PnP rules, but that's how it works in NWN.
Yup. _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
Edited By sbtedarknight on 07/09/07 21:19
Quote: Posted 07/09/07 20:57 (GMT) -- Cinnabar Din
You don't have to be able to cast arcane spells; you only need a single level in an arcane casting class. Not the way it's supposed to work as per the PnP rules, but that's how it works in NWN.
oh, if you say so. I remember trying that, and not being able to take the class... but i was rather ignorant back then, so i might have just missed the BAB requirement
Quote: Posted 07/09/07 21:29 (GMT) -- eltrentoro oh, if you say so.
look at the note's here , I didn't think it would work with an 08 in charisma either. _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
Edited By sbtedarknight on 07/09/07 21:42
Very quick rebuild and test, changed the lvl split as I didn't need so many barb lvl's for thundering rage , also dropped blind fight for an extra epic feat slot. Didn't increase charisma so still no spells. Changed the melee weapon from battle axe to long sword, but that's a builder preferance that can be changed (simple or martial). Messed with the skills a little, no hide or move silently as I didn't think it fit with a barbarian in full plate running around (still just a builder preferance though). Increased AA levels prior to character level 20. Still a pvm or party play character.
Build Name:Overwhelming Thunder V.2 Gender:Builder preferance Race:Half-Elf Alignment:Any Non-Lawful Barbarian 17/Sorcerer 1/Arcane Archer 22 stats starting/ending/rage Str 16 / 25 / 31 Dex 13 / 14 Con 16 / 18 / 24 Wis 08 Int 13 Cha 08
naked/rage Ac 16 / 14 with mundane plate 23 / 21 with mundane plate and tower shield: 26 / 24
Hp 460 / 580 (no rerolls unsure of max)
For 27 / 30 Ref 26 / 26 Wil 21 / 24
Bab:29 Ab unarmed: 36/31/26/21 /\ 39/34/29/24 Ab mundane bow: 43/38/33/28 (no change in rage) Ab mundane long sword: 36/31/26/21 /\ 39/34/29/24
Quick Pros: slightly higher reflex and will saves compared to the original. Quick Cons: slightly lower ac and ab than original.
+ I almost suggest taking armor skin here to make up for the rage decrease in ac this makes up for the decrease(ac) compared to the original, then your only -1 ab lower than the original build.
Placement concentration(co) +10 (14) discipline(di) +42 (49) intimidate(in) +42 (41) listen(li) +43 (43) spot(sp) +36 (36) tumble(tu) +20 (22) _________________ Spirit, It is the hero's strength, the mother's resilience, and the poor man's armor. It cannot be broken, and it cannot be taken away. This I must believe. ~ Drizzt Do'Urden
attention/help 
) 
You're right 
depends on my kids 
? I know that overwhelming does stack. But have been unable to verify if devastating does or not (do you know?). 
(it will if you change sorc to wiz tho)
) 
, also dropped blind fight for an extra epic feat slot. Didn't increase charisma so still no spells. Changed the melee weapon from battle axe to long sword, but that's a builder preferance that can be changed (simple or martial). Messed with the skills a little, no hide or move silently as I didn't think it fit with a barbarian in full plate running around (still just a builder preferance though). Increased AA levels prior to character level 20.