Here we go, I've tried my hand again, and here is my third build to be posted, so let's dive into it.

This is my Rogue/Cleric/WeaponMaster build, known as 'The Blessed Trickster' It's a shot at a build with alot of sneaks, good

buffing and WM crit goodness. I looked in the search engine and found three other builds with this lineup, none chose to take

my Charisma method though. So without further ado...

The Blessed Trickster
Human Any allignment.

Summary Class Race Rogue(24), Cleric(9), Weapon Master(7), Human

Abilies STR: 15
DEX: 13
CON: 8
WIS: 14 (15)
INT: 13
CHA: 14 (24)


1 Rogue(1): Dodge, Expertise
2 Rogue(2): {Evasion}
3 Rogue(3): Weapon focus: Rapier, {Uncanny Dodge I}
4 Cleric(1): CHA+1, Domain Travel, Domain Magic, (CHA=15)
5 Cleric(2)
6 Cleric(3): Mobility
7 Cleric(4)
8 Cleric(5): CHA+1, (CHA=16)
9 Cleric(6): Spring attack
10 Cleric(7)
11 Rogue(4)
12 Rogue(5): CHA+1, Whirlwind Attack, (CHA=17)
13 Weapon Master(1): Weapon of Choice: Rapier
14 Weapon Master(2)
15 Weapon Master(3): Power Attack
16 Weapon Master(4): CHA+1, (CHA=18)
17 Weapon Master(5)
18 Cleric(8): Divine Might
19 Weapon Master(6)
20 Weapon Master(7): CHA+1, (CHA=19)
21 Cleric(9): Great Wisdom I, (WIS=15)
22 Rogue(6)
23 Rogue(7)
24 Rogue(8): CHA+1, Epic Weapon Focus: Rapier, (CHA=20)
25 Rogue(9)
26 Rogue(10): Crippling strike
27 Rogue(11): Epic Prowess
28 Rogue(12): CHA+1, (CHA=21)
29 Rogue(13): Improved Evasion
30 Rogue(14): Improved Critical: Rapier
31 Rogue(15)
32 Rogue(16): CHA+1, Improved Sneak Attack I, (CHA=22)
33 Rogue(17): Improved Sneak Attack II
34 Rogue(18)
35 Rogue(19): Improved Sneak Attack III
36 Rogue(20): CHA+1, Improved Sneak Attack IV, (CHA=23)
37 Rogue(21)
38 Rogue(22)
39 Rogue(23): Improved Sneak Attack V
40 Rogue(24): CHA+1, Improved Sneak Attack VI, (CHA=24)



Statistic Hitpoints: 246
Skillpoints: 334
Saving Throws (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): 18/21/22
Saving Throw bonuses: Traps: +5
BAB: 26
AB (max, naked): 33 (melee), 28 (ranged)
AC (naked/mundane armor/shield only): 19/30
Spell Casting: Cleric(5)
Alignment Changes: 0

Skills Concentration 24(23), Disable Trap 43(44), Discipline 22(24), Intimidate 5(12), Open Lock 43(44), Search

43(44), Tumble 43(44), UMD 43(50)
68 Leftover

Damage

Regular raiper

1-6+
4 STR+
5 GMW
+2 Divien Favour
+1-6 Darkfire
+4 Darkfire
+2 Battletide
+17-106 Sneak attack
+ 9 Divine Might
--------------
44-141 damage

Critical hit!
x3
------
132 - 423

Just felt like adding that in....


Breads thoughts-
- IC comes a bit late in the build, I was considering pushing back Divine Might in order to get it earlier but I decided

against it.
- Skillpoints, alot of them.
- Disarm trap and Open lock, good for getting your fingers where they aren't meant to be.
- High UMD and tumble ducking out of the way and reading a piece of paper that destroys stuff ahs never been so easy...
- I'm rather happy with the damage.
- HP seems a bit low.

Anything I've missed?

I suppose I now open the floor, anyone wanna complain?

Edited By Kail Pendragon on 11/30/07 13:34

First, sneak damage DOESNT multiply with a critical. If it did, there would be a ton of rogue/wm (i cant tell if you calculated that in, but it looks like it). For this reason, it has been determined a long while ago (by guild) that sneak and crits in a build is redundant. why? Immune to criticals negates ALL your damage! (of course NOT the cleric buffs, hence my LOVE of clerics, but this can be negated in other ways).

In my view, giving up all those feats for wm isnt worth it for this build. Your caster level is way to low for using the cleric buffs (to my liking, but I am strange like that). Honestly, the fact that you decided against adding to an ab stat makes me worried too.

In order to tweak it abit, changing it the least, I would go 17 cleric/23 rogue OR 17cl/22r/1sd.... ooohh. The strategy could be using Storm of vengence with all the divine damage and sneaks!! OUCH! See SOV, im not sure if you are aware or not, has this really nice stun ability which leaves your opponents open to the huge sneak damage! The sd1 for HIP again is there to give you a chance to use the sneakss=. One of the difficulties of a rogue build with no dex or HIP is HOW do i get to sneak folks? I am assuming you are using full plate, which makes it harder to do. Keep in mind, with only 17 cleric levels you will have very few sovs and they last only 10 rounds, so again, how will you get sneaks?

Just some things to think about (on paper there are alot of amazing ideas, but its executing them in game that becomes the challenge).
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Quote: Posted 07/24/06 22:47:54 (GMT) -- FinneousPJ

You should listen to avado

I only wonder about one thing: what on earth do you gain from a high charisma..?!

I can see that a few more rounds of divine trickery could be useful in a few occations... but that is about all you get from it too. But with so few cleric levels... thats hardly anything to speak of.

(EDIT): Ok, I can see the divine might part... but basing a non-paladin build on that ability alone when you would be so immensively much more powerful and longer lasting with more cleric spells?

Curiously yours,
Cero.

Edited By Cerolill on 11/24/07 17:57

I don't mean to be offensive, but have you tested this build in game? It doesn't seem like it will hold its own for a lot of time. I mean, low HP, low AB, little to no spells... how will you hurt someone?
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"Hats off and applause to rogues and evolution" High charisma works for Cleric if you take Divine Might, Divine Shield or War Domain, but you're feat starved already to take Divine feats, you shouldn't take them, and well, 24 is really way off the scale of utility, that high CHA is meant only for Sorcerers, Bards and Smiters.

Cleric 9 does give useful buffs, but personally, I never take less than 11 when I go Cleric though.

The best criticals get around 300 I think, when you use a Weapon Master / Cleric / Fighter with a Scythe, you obviously can get it higher with powerful equipment. The highest one-hit-kill criticals come from a Scythe Weapon Master /Paladin in a critical smite, counting a high Great Smite feat, I think those can reach a bit above 1000. Sneaks don't get multiplied obviously, because a Rogue 33 / Weapon Master 7 with all that Improved Sneak Attack and the nice X5 Scythe multiplier would easily deal to about 500 and above 700 on high rolls, being also a much more practical and efficient way than relying on smites.

The big problem with this build is AB, you focus a lot on CHA for your Divine might which only deals unbuffed 7 divine damage, even buffed to max that's +13 damage. Well, it does sounds like a great damage addition when you say +13 divine damage, however, what's more important, hit all your 17d6 sneak attacks, or a single +13 divine damage? hitting is a priority before damage, 33 AB is too low for any type of combat build.
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"My name is Thaxll'ssyllia, but you simians may refer to me merely as "Sir", if you prefer a less... syllable intensive workout."

Edwin Odesseiron - Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn

Edited By Thaxll'ssyllia on 11/25/07 05:00

As noted above, the AB is so low that you really need the Cleric buffs to land your attacks. But then you will need more Cleric lvls to get all the spells and make them last.
A high Charisma is useful in a Cleric made for turning, but for that purpose you need all the cleric lvls you can get. Charisma is also useful in a build where you have some CoT lvls. As it is now I don't think you get enough synergy from your heavy Charisma investment.
Divine Power helps a bit with the AB even in a Cleric 9 build, but to make it useful with so few Cleric lvls, I recommend Strength domain and Extend Spell so you can have Divine Power extended in both your lvl 4 and lvl 5 slots.
If you focused on Dex as your main stat with Weapon Finesse, you could get a (fun to play IMO) Rogue/Cleric sneaker build.
I doubt the feat investment to get WM pays off in that kind of build.
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I generally avoid temptation, unless I can't resist it...