Schmelv reeled backwards from the verbal assault being perpertrated through his front door. Schmelv's hand instictively arced towards the underarm ultra-quick-release scabbard (patent pending) where his handaxe nestled.
"STRONG ONES, WISE ONES, BIG ONES, SMALL ONES. BECOME A CLEEEEEERIIIIIIC Noowwww.....!!!"
Schmelv at this point was processing two simultaneous thoughts, 1) Man, diret marketing is getting REAL direct nowdays. 2) This insane idiot is gonna die. DIE! DIE!!! (three exclamation marks pointing out to the mentally astute that this point was very important to Schmelv and propbably deserved to be number one in this list)
"REPENT!"
Standing in his doorway was a Cleric of Odava. A real nauseatingly persistent bunch of loonies that would stop at nothing to spread their very own ideas of exactly how everyone should live their lives, and be dammed to rot in eternal damnation (or watching Nicolas Cage movie re-runs) if you didnt. The very idea of which they simply didnt seem to have the will, or mental faculty to process.
Now, this particular cleric disciple reeled backwards as the back of Schmelv's very sharp, very pointy axe made a bee-line towards his left eyeball. This was not entirely an unexpected outcome to the first round of delivering this particular sales pitch. It was just that in this case, the sales target (Schmelv) happened to be an ultra experienced elite veteran wood-elf Wild Rider. The very fact that the disciple was still alive was only testament to Schmelv being drunk off his rocker on dwarf mead, a particularly nasty little boutique brew originating from a little micro-brewery names Grizz Rot-Gut or Gut-Rot-Grizz or somesuch, Schmelv couldnt remember, but you get the drift. The Wild Rider's reflexes were legendary, their general ability to skewer and carve their enemies into shapes that were not very much like the blueprint design that their hereditary DNA (or creator, take your pick) intended were stuff of fable. Death at the pointy end of a Wild Rider's weapon was ultimately very fast and disruptive to ambitions of happily-ever-after. Goes without saying really doesnt it.
But Schmelv stopped. The pointy end of the handaxe was a mere fraction of a millimeter from the hapless Cleric's aforementioned left eyeball, the Cleric was delicately balanced on the balls of his feet, his back making such a perfect arch that any yogii would have been very proud. The Cleric stood very still. Schmelv also stood motionless. Well, his handaxe did .. the rest of his body wavered a bit in his drunken state, and in the stillness of the moment he let out a little beer-n-beans fart. The Cleric didnt quite see the mirth in the situation, but the thought did trigger the hey-thats-kinda-hilarious part of Schmelv's psyche.
'Wots goin on 'ere den eh?" Schmelv's drinking buddy Eddy staggered up behind the pair at the front door. Staggered is probably giving Eddy too much credit for the gyrations that brought him to the front of the house. But to the front he did get, and was now surveying the scene, not quite comprehending, yet his evil twisted mind sensing that this could be an interesting development in an afternoon that was going to hell in a drunken handbasket anyway.
At this point, dear reader, we take the literary liberty of casting the story backwards somewhat. You may well be wondering how Schmelv has found himself on the wrong end of 40 (in pure mechanical terms, but his elf-age was upwards of 320) and deep in the throes of alcoholic suspension. His career was always on the fast track. Schmelv found his stardom through an initial hard slog however, eking out a living in the wood-elf frontline archer regiments. His archery was commendable by wood elf standards, if not entirely up to scratch for where he started out. This of course translates into an archery skill considered stupendously excellent by most other standards. However, it didnt take long for an astute noble one day, in seeing another side of Schmelv during some regimental excercises. Schmelv's propensity for violence was second to none, a real A-grade nut job when the bell of battle tolled. His riding skill was also right up there, so naturally he was shepherded into the shock troop of the wood-elf corps. The Wild Riders of Kournos.
These boys and gals liked nothing better than charging down their enemy, fully standing astride their mount, hair flying in the wind and tattooed bodies on (nearly) full display; immense compound bows whistling in the wind delivering a proverbial hail of death and mayhem, and then whipping out assorted paraphernalia (daggers, handaxes, maces etc) for the close-up destruction of whatever happens to still be standing. Kinda think along the lines of a bunch of american indians screaming down at you at full tilt, and I dont care even if youre name is M.R.Morrison, and you have fixed all the wagons for all the little ladies in the world .. you're toast. Just ask G.A.Custer what its like.
Schmelv made it to the very highest of echelons in the Wild Rider corps, his tattoos marking the highest of high distinctions and commendations. His fans adored him, his peers respected him, his enemies generally didnt think much cos they were mostly dead. We all of course know that mostly dead isnt necessarily all dead, and with the right potions and bellows you can bring people back from the ultimate brink etc etc etc (if you get the pop-culture reference then we have said enough and you know what i mean, otherwse its tough-bikkies and we get back to the program). I digress.
However, Schmelv let his fame get to him, and started indulging in all sorts of goody-goody treats, amongst which was deep-fried peanut butter banana toastees. Yuech. No wonder he spent more and more of his time in the service on the latrines. Thusly resulting in a decay in his moral fortitude and physical prowess that ultimately saw him fall from grace, and end buddied-up with the miscreant colloquially known as 'Unsteady Eddy' (which some readers may already be aquainted with from prior frays into the depths my somewhat disturbed mind), working odd-jobs for one real mean s.o.b that goes by the name 'Wallace'.
"Eddy." Schmelv barked out, and Eddy stopped on the spot. Eddy was looking much worse for wear than he usually did. He was just about partied-out. "Eddy, dont puke on my floor. This damn floor has just been sanded, resurfaced, and laminated in the most ridiculously expensive imported crap you ever heard, and I aint gonna have you messin it up. The Cleaner (tm) took great pains to make sure that stunt you pulled last week washed off this damn floor, and dont make me have to re-pontificate about the finer points of the path of the righteous man being beset on all sides by any and all inequities, and having to be shepherded through some stoopid valley of darkness cos I AM the shadow of death, I AM the inequity, and I aint gonna be shepherding your or anyones hiney for much longer, in fact there will be great vengeance and furious anger vented on ANYONE that even thinks about just scratching this BRAND. NEW. FLOOR".
A drip of sweat dribbled its way down the Cleric of Odava's forehead, and out onto the point of his nose. This was'nt looking good. Not good at all.
"If youre gonna hurl, hurl into this"
With his free hand Schmelv reached inside the top pocket of his vest and retreived a crumpled up paper cup.
Eddy looked at the cup.
"HUH?"
"Eddy, take the cup."
The Cleric of Odaman now knew he was in real deep trouble. These guys were first-grade nutters. He had met real-deal Hillbillies that were more predictable and less likely to pig-spit him.
"And Eddy, bring out the Gimp"
"But Schmelv, the Gimp's asleep"
Yep. Reeeal trouble.
-----------------
Wild Rider of Kournos
Not spectacular, but playable. Probably best for Low magic, but viable for mid magic pw's, PVE only.
Concept: This is a themed Asrai (Wood Elf) build. It is a DEX mounted archer .. a wild rider that can pack a punch from afar then close in for the finessed melee kill. Can call upon the forest spirits for combat and ability boosts (approximated via wiz spells, barb rage)
There are some ok synergies going on with this build..
Barbarian - Uncanny Dodge to retain Dex bonus when flatfooted - Rage for extra str melee (and ranged mighty) damage.. too much str is often wasted on non dev crit archers due to mighty limitations on weapons - 10% movement to help with sniping, repositioning etc - always handy with an archer - terrifying rage
Wiz - Can buff Dex, Con, Str, AC - use arcane scrolls
AA - Helps qualify for 19 pre-epic BAB that counts towards melee AB
Feats selections explained: - Ride skill, with Mounted Combat feat: +6 AC .. +8AC if Dex modifier taken is into account by the NW engine (not sure on this one). This gives the toon an acceptable AC given there is no primary tumble dump class. These 2 feats are integral to the concept of build - Terrifying Rage .. -2 AB to all, with little chance of resistance (vs DC51+1d10) - Weapon finesse .. (use mace to deal bludgeon dmg when required), gives sword&board option (no tower shield though)
Skills - taunt taken for boss fights where a bit of boost is required - low 40's discipline is almost as good as no discipline, but with some str buff spells and rage it goes up a bit
Additional Notes: - Handaxe in this version is style only, replace with mace would be smarter, or drop the 2 wf feats and get blindfight and probably impr crit longbow - For a more straight-up shooter, drop 4Wiz for 4AA to get around 57ab ranged
Critique away. _________________ Workings of a Chaotic-Neutral mind:
Mind to Subconscious: Sir! Host is being asked to read the rules! Subconscious to Mind: But theres pr0n to watch! Mind to Subconscious: Happy to report Host has beaten us to it! Subconscious to Mind: We ROCK!
Edited By Kail Pendragon on 06/12/10 00:43
EDR3 Version .. AA still gives plenty of ranged firepower, but melee is gone.
Disable Trap 1(3), Discipline 42(43), Intimidate 42(41), Open Lock 1(7), Spellcraft 43(45), Taunt 42(41), Ride 42(48), remaining skillpoints 33 _________________ Workings of a Chaotic-Neutral mind:
Mind to Subconscious: Sir! Host is being asked to read the rules! Subconscious to Mind: But theres pr0n to watch! Mind to Subconscious: Happy to report Host has beaten us to it! Subconscious to Mind: We ROCK!
aaaand .. a STR version (prolly my fave)
Disable Trap 1(3), Discipline 42(51), Intimidate 42(51), Open Lock 1(4), Spellcraft 43(45), Taunt 42(41), Ride 42(45), remaining skillpoints 39 _________________ Workings of a Chaotic-Neutral mind:
Mind to Subconscious: Sir! Host is being asked to read the rules! Subconscious to Mind: But theres pr0n to watch! Mind to Subconscious: Happy to report Host has beaten us to it! Subconscious to Mind: We ROCK!
Why do you say no tower shield?
IMOs...
Dual-wielding is a waste. BF and imp crit are clearly preferable.
Discipline w/ the DEX version is a waste.
A STR based archer w/out Dev Crit? Smells fishy.
Overall, I agree. It's more than playable, but not fantastic. I think you achieve your goals though. I'll give points for making a Terrifying Rage archer. Not sure it makes the most sense, but, heck, there's a bit of coolness to be had.
Discipline is never a waste.
Quote: Posted 06/11/10 19:44 (GMT) -- DocRufio
Discipline is never a waste.
It easily is, if KD immunity is available. _________________ They can't stop us Let them try For Heavy Metal We will die
k, i applaud the 3 builds, though not sure why you didnt decide on a "best" one. While you did put BAB 29 (which they all are), you DIDNT put the ab in each build.
The strength build, while having the same BAB as the dexer, DOESNT have any stat modifier towards AB vs the dexer version. It would be helpful to have added the AB line with a mundane bow in order to truly compare the builds. I have always found it best, when putting up a build, to not leave much up to the imagination of the reader. AB calcs ARE complex if you arent certain.
That said, i dont understand going high str with a dex weapon with no dev crit. Maybe you could explain it to make us understand? As it stands, it reminds me of a guy one time who did an ICONIC shadow dancer, but couldnt decide on ONE, so he posted 4 ICONIC shadowdancer builds...
Quote: Posted 06/11/10 19:44 (GMT) -- DocRufio
Discipline is never a waste.
Not so. Discipline is often a waste. Explain to me how a sub-par discipline is useful.
LMAO! I am mistaken! THe AB is in there! My bad. I guess it serves me right trying to evaluate with my 2 year old running around my ankles!
Re: discipline .. i probably should have added that esf:intimidate can easily be swapped out for esf:discipline
To be honest, terrifying rage is a gimmick at best, and the discipline boost in the 'real world' is a much better proposition. Especially if you can get +12 str, and even a modest disc boost item. This gets you to around the 60 mark, which based on my (mostly medium magic pw) experiece is a number i'm comfy with. _________________ Workings of a Chaotic-Neutral mind:
Mind to Subconscious: Sir! Host is being asked to read the rules! Subconscious to Mind: But theres pr0n to watch! Mind to Subconscious: Happy to report Host has beaten us to it! Subconscious to Mind: We ROCK!
Quote: Posted 06/11/10 01:51 (GMT) -- onion eater
Why do you say no tower shield?
IMOs...
Dual-wielding is a waste. BF and imp crit are clearly preferable.
There is no intention to dual wield. Use whatever shield you want. Cant remember why i said no tower.
Quote: Discipline w/ the DEX version is a waste.
Yeah sometimes .. up to you if you can boost it to a meaningful number by some other means. Otherwise swap it out.
Quote: A STR based archer w/out Dev Crit? Smells fishy.
im not a big fan of dev crit, and dev crit archers have been done, i like quirky 'what the hell is that' type of toon. If it has some flaws that need to be intelligently played around then all the better. I have tested all 3 and they fare well (except vs prismatic, that was pretty much a rout), but it was the str version that i leveled up in my regular pw .. and it was a blast to play, received quite a few comments. I am all for originality in this tired but awesome game.
Quote: Overall, I agree. It's more than playable, but not fantastic. I think you achieve your goals though. I'll give points for making a Terrifying Rage archer. Not sure it makes the most sense, but, heck, there's a bit of coolness to be had.
Thanks for the feedback. I agree, not uber, but something to flex the brain muscle on. _________________ Workings of a Chaotic-Neutral mind:
Mind to Subconscious: Sir! Host is being asked to read the rules! Subconscious to Mind: But theres pr0n to watch! Mind to Subconscious: Happy to report Host has beaten us to it! Subconscious to Mind: We ROCK!
Quote: Posted 06/14/10 22:42 (GMT) -- jumjones im not a big fan of dev crit, and dev crit archers have been done, i like quirky 'what the hell is that' type of toon. If it has some flaws that need to be intelligently played around then all the better. I have tested all 3 and they fare well (except vs prismatic, that was pretty much a rout), but it was the str version that i leveled up in my regular pw .. and it was a blast to play, received quite a few comments. I am all for originality in this tired but awesome game.
I dont think that is what the question was. You did an ARCHER which, without dev crit, means adding stats to anything other than dex means you are making a less than optimal character in terms of AB. I think, at least for myself, WHY would you knowingly make a character that isnt optimized (i realize that many do, but they do it mostly unknowingly). I fear the answer will be, "cuz i can"...
Quote: Posted 06/12/10 01:33 (GMT) -- onion eater
Quote: Posted 06/11/10 19:44 (GMT) -- DocRufio
Discipline is never a waste.
Not so. Discipline is often a waste. Explain to me how a sub-par discipline is useful.
no one plays this game with naked stats, so get some str boosts and some discipline boosting items, and esf: discipline and you'll have plenty, unless you cross-class, which is more of an issue. I wouldn't want to be kded by every living thing with the feat. One kd can spell a quick death.
It can be useless if you have KD and disarm immunities, but most servers and modules I have played don't have those.
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 02:55 (GMT) -- DocRufio
no one plays this game with naked stats, so get some str boosts and some discipline boosting items, and esf: discipline and you'll have plenty...
It is assumed that anything that is available to one, is available to all. If this guy can get STR gear, and discipline boosting items, then a STR based character can too. If the mod is reasonably balanced, that gear is taken into account. I'm not even considering that in my experience, anything but an awesome discipline isn't worth it. That's more of just a general bias.
Plus, there's the whole AC:discipline ratio. If your AC is significantly better than your discipline (by 20? I forget the mechanics), then your discipline is literally useless.
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 00:48 (GMT) -- avado
Quote: Posted 06/14/10 22:42 (GMT) -- jumjones im not a big fan of dev crit, and dev crit archers have been done, i like quirky 'what the hell is that' type of toon. If it has some flaws that need to be intelligently played around then all the better. I have tested all 3 and they fare well (except vs prismatic, that was pretty much a rout), but it was the str version that i leveled up in my regular pw .. and it was a blast to play, received quite a few comments. I am all for originality in this tired but awesome game.
I dont think that is what the question was. You did an ARCHER which, without dev crit, means adding stats to anything other than dex means you are making a less than optimal character in terms of AB. I think, at least for myself, WHY would you knowingly make a character that isnt optimized (i realize that many do, but they do it mostly unknowingly). I fear the answer will be, "cuz i can"...
I dont want an optimal AB. Shock. Horror.
... the two non DEX variants have decent enough AB as it is. True, go dex, increase AB/AC. But .. Go STR and you have a more rounded toon, able to deal with more situations (undead, constructs etc), go the CON route and get EDR3, extended rage durations, better HP.
Are they one-man wrecking machines? no, but more than playable - fun - this sort of toon gives you a different gameplay, a different frame of mind. I find that quite interesting.
Its merely a trade-off to shoot for some balance.
I dont necessarily nerf a toon just for the sake of it .. I am still interested in bringing out the best out of the various options, looking for the synergies between classes and feats and skills. Which is the power of this guild, otherwise I guess I wouldnt bother posting. _________________ Workings of a Chaotic-Neutral mind:
Mind to Subconscious: Sir! Host is being asked to read the rules! Subconscious to Mind: But theres pr0n to watch! Mind to Subconscious: Happy to report Host has beaten us to it! Subconscious to Mind: We ROCK!
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 04:07 (GMT) -- onion eater
Plus, there's the whole AC:discipline ratio. If your AC is significantly better than your discipline (by 20? I forget the mechanics), then your discipline is literally useless.
20s will knock you down no matter how high the AC-AB differential is: even a mediocre discipline will hence protect you from mobs. KD immunity removes only the concern about KD but leaves those regarding Disarm and Called Shot; in all PvMs environment I played in a well prepared player can deal with them, thus making Discipline an investment not really worth the cost IMO (especially since I'm always short on skillpoints) and KD immunity is (unfortunately?) pretty common in my experience (both player and monster side). I just wish we had PnP like Trip instead of the borked up system BW implemented... _________________ They can't stop us Let them try For Heavy Metal We will die
Quote:
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 04:17 (GMT) -- jumjones
I dont think that is what the question was. You did an ARCHER which, without dev crit, means adding stats to anything other than dex means you are making a less than optimal character in terms of AB. I think, at least for myself, WHY would you knowingly make a character that isnt optimized (i realize that many do, but they do it mostly unknowingly). I fear the answer will be, "cuz i can"...
I dont want an optimal AB. Shock. Horror.
... the two non DEX variants have decent enough AB as it is. True, go dex, increase AB/AC. But .. Go STR and you have a more rounded toon, able to deal with more situations (undead, constructs etc), go the CON route and get EDR3, extended rage durations, better HP.
Are they one-man wrecking machines? no, but more than playable - fun - this sort of toon gives you a different gameplay, a different frame of mind. I find that quite interesting.
Its merely a trade-off to shoot for some balance.
I dont necessarily nerf a toon just for the sake of it .. I am still interested in bringing out the best out of the various options, looking for the synergies between classes and feats and skills. Which is the power of this guild, otherwise I guess I wouldnt bother posting.
Given the radical differences between your builds you should make a thread for each one: Dex, Str and Con variant. _________________ They can't stop us Let them try For Heavy Metal We will die
Edited By Kail Pendragon on 06/15/10 09:53
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 04:17 (GMT) -- jumjones
I dont want an optimal AB. Shock. Horror.
... the two non DEX variants have decent enough AB as it is. True, go dex, increase AB/AC. But .. Go STR and you have a more rounded toon, able to deal with more situations (undead, constructs etc), go the CON route and get EDR3, extended rage durations, better HP.
Are they one-man wrecking machines? no, but more than playable - fun - this sort of toon gives you a different gameplay, a different frame of mind. I find that quite interesting.
Its merely a trade-off to shoot for some balance.
I dont necessarily nerf a toon just for the sake of it .. I am still interested in bringing out the best out of the various options, looking for the synergies between classes and feats and skills. Which is the power of this guild, otherwise I guess I wouldnt bother posting.
LOL No shock. No horror. Using classes in ways that one wouldnt expect IS good building. Lord knows ive done it in my building in the past.
I guess what is missing, like Kail suggests, is the builds ARE different. The dex one plays different than the str one (and who knows about ed3! LOL) Maybe, a playstyle guide for each would help. In all honesty, you see focus in bow and AA and it suggests one thing. If you play it another way, it could be helpful for those of us "stuck" in our ways to "get it"
Thanks for the edumication
Where I usually play there are no KD immunites and it is possible to get enough discipline on a dexterity based character to be reasonably difficult to KD or disarm. Of course you can get more on a str based character, but that is silly to say that if you can't have as much as a str based character, that you don't want any at all. Just because you won't resist everything doesn't mean that you should just give up and not be able to resist anything. I am biased because of where I play, so maybe the issue is more server-specific than I would think.
*edit* on a side note, I suppose most things are server and module specific. I can't use builds off this forum unfortunately because they generally don't meet the needs of the server that I play on.
Edited By DocRufio on 06/15/10 17:09
A couple more words, and then I'll be done, as this isn't really the place for a discussion of the usefulness of discipline, or the lack thereof.
First, yes, this can be hugely server specific. In general, I prefer to speak of these things with two considerations. One is imagining a world where there are no items, or alterations. Two is to imagine a common, well-balanced world. Yes, those are woefully imprecise. If something works where you play, then more power to ya, but I try to think of these things in the abstract, as well as what in my experience is the most likely situation.
Towards that end, if you're playing in a world where KD is used often by the enemies, there is likely KD immunity, and you likely need it, unless you can have an excellent discipline. In my experience, this is the most common situation, and I find that sad.
In such a world, one really needs a reasonable assurance that one is going to not be knocked on one's butt the majority of the time. If your discipline is such that you will fail, say, 50% of the time, then it is not reliable, and hence, useless. Either non STR builds will suffer greatly, or there is KD immunity. A sub-par discipline is then only useful when dealing with grossly inferior enemies.
Yes, I am speaking only of KD. Called Shot and Disarm are both far less common, and easier to deal with when they do occur. KD, on the other hand, can lead to a quick demise. Either your discipline is sufficient to handle the KD attempts, or it isn't, and you need to look elsewhere.
Again, of course, results may vary. Generally speaking though, I think it's a good rule that discipline on a DEX build is a waste.
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 16:58 (GMT) -- DocRufio on a side note, I suppose most things are server and module specific. I can't use builds off this forum unfortunately because they generally don't meet the needs of the server that I play on.
This point is a tough one, and not for the reasons that seem obvious.
While there are servers which dictate your number of class levels and try even harder to maintain "balance" (which is impossible with this game, in my experience) by limiting classes that you can play with each other. I have even seen some that dictate the alignment!
All that aside, the ECB IS and always has been (at least since 2005) a place where mundane is the key. I dare not say all the builds, as a few may have slipped by the group, but the rules of the guild have been to post with MUNDANE armor and weapons PRIMARILY. What this means is, the builds are supposed to stand as they are with NO ITEM MODIFICATIONS allowed in the postings. In other words, i may have built a character to use the most powerful weapon on a pw, but if i were posting it here, the build would NOT include that items mods in calculations. The build MUST stand NEKKID! (with mundane gear only).
What this allows for, we hope, is for the player to look at a build and being familiar with what is available on the mod/pw, could assertain for themselves how the build would be like. Of course, foci (wpn and spell) are ALWAYS up to the player to choose, the build being a guide.
There have been very few builds that i havent monkeyed with when playing on a pw to fit my personal needs. The adapting of level splits to meet requirements isnt a big deal USUALLY. What i am saying is, NONE of the builds in ECB should be looked at as FINAL! There is always somethingt to tinker with to make it your own.
SO, to sum up: NO, none of the builds on ECB are server specific as they "all" should be done with mundane gear, no items. SO if a build ROCKS here, it will ROCK even harder with gear!
Hope that makes sense _________________
Quote: -- Posted by Kail Pendragon
Being hyperbolic is an integral part of Avado's being
These builds stand alone, but discussion need not. We should always remember that the purpose of these builds is to be played, and that no build exists in a vacuum. Yes, always assume no gear, and represent the build itself without any environmental specifics, but that is more of an agreed upon formality, for clarity's sake. Don't forget that a build which rocks may not rock all the more when decked out with gear. Never will all things be equal.
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 13:20 (GMT) -- avado In all honesty, you see focus in bow and AA and it suggests one thing.
Focus i bow means there is reason to believe that the character is supposed to use a bow. That's the easy part. AA means you get a huge boost to AB and damage when you start to stack the levels. That gives room for doing other things than maxing AB and still get an AB that is good enough. Examples: Strength based archer with dev crit. Charisma based archer with divine might/shield. "Spellbows" with a relatively high caster level and the bow as a sidearm. etc The EA feat of the AA gives great room for flexibility when it comes to building archers. And perhaps that's the really easy part _________________ I generally avoid temptation, unless I can't resist it...
Quote: Posted 06/16/10 12:04 (GMT) -- Mick Dagger
Quote: Posted 06/15/10 13:20 (GMT) -- avado In all honesty, you see focus in bow and AA and it suggests one thing.
Focus i bow means there is reason to believe that the character is supposed to use a bow. That's the easy part. AA means you get a huge boost to AB and damage when you start to stack the levels. That gives room for doing other things than maxing AB and still get an AB that is good enough. Examples: Strength based archer with dev crit. Charisma based archer with divine might/shield. "Spellbows" with a relatively high caster level and the bow as a sidearm. etc The EA feat of the AA gives great room for flexibility when it comes to building archers. And perhaps that's the really easy part
Yea thats exactly how I started looking at things too, it took me a while cos im a sloooow learner, but once you see past the obvious use of a feat/skill/etc, and start looking for synergies it opens up interesting options.
Its making them playable and tweaking them to taste is where the ECB comes in, and personal preferences.
Which is why I presented 2 additional variants to the original .. same concept, different game experience. I dont consider them different enough for seperate postings. Just taking them one step removed from what 90% of would immediately focus on in a build. _________________ Workings of a Chaotic-Neutral mind:
Mind to Subconscious: Sir! Host is being asked to read the rules! Subconscious to Mind: But theres pr0n to watch! Mind to Subconscious: Happy to report Host has beaten us to it! Subconscious to Mind: We ROCK!
Where I usually play there are no KD immunites and it is possible to get enough discipline on a dexterity based character to be reasonably difficult to KD or disarm. Of course you can get more on a str based character, but that is silly to say that if you can't have as much as a str based character, that you don't want any at all. Just because you won't resist everything doesn't mean that you should just give up and not be able to resist anything. I am biased because of where I play, so maybe the issue is more server-specific than I would think.