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Here is the latest application of Tyrpaladin logic.

I am a hypocrit for having posted an example build to someone in the general HotU thread. Here we have Tyrpaladin comparing it with her posting incomplete builds in the excellent build thread on the general page and posting them on the epic build forum.

I am quite frankly getting sick and few up of Tyrpaladins behaviour on these threads and on the main board.

Anuis, I ask you to have a look at what benefit you have in having Tyrpaladin in the guild when most people either just look over her stuff to find the mistakes or just ignore the builds altogether because they know they will have that many mistakes in them. She frequently makes attacks on other peoples builds without really justifying it(see the Wizard 38/SD2 thread that was posted).

We have her outright lying (having posted saying she suggested I use a rapier in my swashbuckler build) and saying I am a hypocrit for posting a rough build in the general hotu thread when somone asked. Then testing it out for a month then posting the final result on the excellent thread and the epic build thread.

I would like to ask what other peoples comments (for and against) to post whether they agree with me or do they think that Tyrpaladin is a fine and upstanding member of this guild and that I should be thrown out for being a "hypocrit".

Please post your opinion.

Syrath I think her posts speak plenty of her worth in this guild, as do anyones. ok, Tyr is a good char builder when she takes her time
"new ultimate archer"/"battle dwarven cleric" look at the reply posts
now if Tyr makes a mistake i,m sure she wants it brought to her attention so she can fix it{like she already has}
..
i cant find Tyr,s post but Tyr says her game is broken or different as she has said she can do these things, like get epic {"something" cant remember} at cot lvl 12 when everyone else can only get it at lvl 14
i think that was it!{i,ve seen the post but can,t find it}
then.. the battle dwarven cleric 39 monk 1 it was suggested why not take 1 bard for bardsong instead of monk..now if Tyr wanted bard she would have taken it BUT she wanted cleric 39 monk 1
fare enough i say its her build..

also she has stated she used lockindals "thundering barbarian"build but altered it to her taste..and changed the name...that makes it a different build..again fare enough i say....Lockindal has not said that he dont approve of Tyr using his build as a blueprint for her to alter to her taste..

whoever reads the replies to Tyr,s build,s can make thier own minds up if they want to make the build or not..

it also seems to me although some replies to her builds are not insulting Tyr is taking them as insulting and replies with an insult.. so any insulting posts by "anyone" not just Tyr will be deleted..

now ..Tyr has asked me to delete all 20 of her builds which i have done ..also she has requested i delete all her posts

..so as a moderator i,m going to respect her wishes and delete them as requested to do so {well not all}
.. so as you can see Tyr is trying to make amends

...come on all lighten up ..give Tyr a break

i for one want Tyr IN the guild
well those are my thoughts on this...griphook

Edited By griphook on 08/09/04 14:50

Syrath101, cry me a river.

Anyway, I just wanted to tell, that I'm having a moderator erase all my builds. Many will be repost, but only the ones I've been pleased with and work. This includes Fifur Gest. I've PM one of the mods to also watch over ANY posts that contain false accusation of stealing, links or indirect comment. I already shown that I've made the Fifur Gest before Lock did.

Also her log out date for the Royal Black Watch was 11:03 PM, Feburary 16 of this year. Her original build was DwD 23/WM 7/FTR 10, she was strength based and she originally wielded a bastard and tower shield. (I'm look at the build now as we speak.) So yes, I originated the build first before Lock did. I don't care for insults, but don't make false accusation about my build.
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Quote: Posted 08/08/04 12:19:55 (GMT) -- Emrill

I think her posts speak plenty of her worth in this guild, as do anyones.

Ghost and Vampire don't work. I can probably get it to work if I add another level of Bard, but I'm not going to do that. That and the vampire aren't coming back after they get erased. All the builds are getting erased and the builds that work are coming back.
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Quote: Posted 08/08/04 06:18:27 (GMT) -- syrath1001

Quote: Posted 08/08/04 03:55:08 (GMT) -- TyrPaladin

The bottom line is: Syrath said he 'fleshed out' the build,

The bottom line is...he's a hypocrite and he hadn't flesh out his build before. End of story. I'm going to sleep now.

Ok so now Im going to post the first builds that Tyrpaladin tried to pass off in the Epic build Thread where the builds are supposed to be legal.

Here is the first version of the DWD build before it was corrected by the rest of the epic builders

Quote: Posted 07/09/04 18:10:56 (GMT) -- TyrPaladin

Alignment: Lawful Good or Neutral.

Str 16 +10
Dex 13
Con 18 +4
Int 13
Wis 10
Cha 6

Saves
Fort - 28
Ref - 23
Will - 22

Highest AB - 42

Damage Reduction 33/-

Fighter
1. Weapon Focus: Great Axe; Toughness
2. Mobility
3. Dodge

Dwarven Defender
4. --; Strength +1
5. --
6. Spring Attack
7. --
8. --; Strength +1
9. Expertise
10. --
11. --
12. Whirlwind; Strength +1
13. --

Weapon Master
14. --
15. Improve Critical
16. --; Strength +1
17. --
18. Great Cleave
19. --
20. --; Strength +1

Epic Dwarven Defender
21. Great Strength
22. --
23. --
24. Great Strength; Epic Weapon Focus; Strength +1
27. Great Strength
28. Overwhelming Critical; Strength +1
29. --
30. Great Consitution
31. --
32. Devastating Critical; Constitution +1
33. Great Consitution
36. Damage Reduction I;Damage Reduction II; Strength +1
39. Knockdown
40. Damage Reduction III; Constitution +1

Notice here we have Great cleave without Cleave or power attack
Notice that Dwarven defender is taken with a BAB of +3 when it needs +7.

How can I be a hypocrit when I criticised Tyrpaladin for posting builds that dont work in both the excellent build thread and in this forum. Both these forums are for complete builds that have been tested. I have never posted builds in either of these forums unless I knew they worked. The builds I have posted have been tested in HotU minimum, frequently through SoU(if the start of the character is different from what I have done before many share similarities) and also against some test monsters at levels beyond HotU.

I would like Anuis to look at this attack against me since it is untrue and to ask whether you really want people like Tyrpaladin in the Epic Characters guild.

If you judge Tyrpaladin to be correct and that I am a hypocrit then by all means please kick me out of the guild.

Syrath

Now where in this post have I made a false accusation.

This is the post you first posted in a forum where the builds are supposed to be legal isnt it.

Otherwise someone is posting builds in your name here.

Oh and BTW I never once posted saying your build is a copy for any of your builds. I dont know what gave you the idea that I had. Other people did.

Syrath

Edited By syrath1001 on 08/09/04 02:17

Now where in this post have I made a false accusation.

Is your name mention? No it isn't why the fawk are you speaking up. I have a serious question for you? If I said another man got raped in alleyway, would still speak up as you are now?

End of Story?

Emrill: You tried to give me some bad advice earlier by telling me to go 14 Int and 18 cha. I don't need another skills. Persuade and Lore of no use to me, nor craft weapon, trap or armor. Plus I won't be able to Divine Might and Shield. Again, before you give some advice on their build. You need to read the build and think why they didn't choice certain, feats, skills before posting.
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Click Here Actually my name is mentioned. I also started this thread. So it could be construed that the comments are directed at me, when you consider that my name is the only one mentioned in the post.

Quote: Posted 08/09/04 02:01:28 (GMT) -- TyrPaladin

Syrath101, cry me a river.

Anyway, I just wanted to tell, that I'm having a moderator erase all my builds. Many will be repost, but only the ones I've been pleased with and work. This includes Fifur Gest. I've PM one of the mods to also watch over ANY posts that contain false accusation of stealing, links or indirect comment. I already shown that I've made the Fifur Gest before Lock did.

Also her log out date for the Royal Black Watch was 11:03 PM, Feburary 16 of this year. Her original build was DwD 23/WM 7/FTR 10, she was strength based and she originally wielded a bastard and tower shield. (I'm look at the build now as we speak.) So yes, I originated the build first before Lock did. I don't care for insults, but don't make false accusation about my build.
Quote: Posted 08/09/04 02:54:23 (GMT) -- syrath1001

Actually my name is mentioned. I also started this thread. So it could be construed that the comments are directed at me, when you consider that my name is the only one mentioned in the post.

So basically........you're paranoid?
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Quote: Posted 08/08/04 23:26:50 (GMT) -- griphook

then.. the battle cleric 39 monk 1 it was suggested why not take 1 bard for bardsong instead of monk..now if Tyr wanted bard she would have taken it BUT she wanted cleric 39 monk 1
fare enough i say its her build..


Just an FYI since I was the one to make this comment -- I was just curious. It seemed to me that the only advantage in the Monk class being utilized would be Evasion. I wondered why she chose Monk when other classes could have equally useful benefits. That's all.

In addition, I think it's fine that TyrPaladin is with us. I just wish she would be a bit less defensive when asked about problems in her builds, and perhaps spend a bit more time tweaking them if possible before posting. Other than that, post away. I've actually used a couple of her builds after tweaking, and they turn out to be just fine.
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Quote: Posted 08/09/04 05:00:22 (GMT) -- kreestopearq

Quote: Posted 08/08/04 23:26:50 (GMT) -- griphook

then.. the battle cleric 39 monk 1 it was suggested why not take 1 bard for bardsong instead of monk..now if Tyr wanted bard she would have taken it BUT she wanted cleric 39 monk 1
fare enough i say its her build..


Just an FYI since I was the one to make this comment -- I was just curious. It seemed to me that the only advantage in the Monk class being utilized would be Evasion. I wondered why she chose Monk when other classes could have equally useful benefits. That's all.

In addition, I think it's fine that TyrPaladin is with us. I just wish she would be a bit less defensive when asked about problems in her builds, and perhaps spend a bit more time tweaking them if possible before posting. Other than that, post away. I've actually used a couple of her builds after tweaking, and they turn out to be just fine.

If you change the weapon choice that's fine for your gameplay, but I made those for good reason for gameplay. Monk class offers Evasion and I technically get a 26 Ref save against spells when saving and the highest most spells go is 36 in DC. So all I have to do is roll a 10 and I can evade the attack. People keep suggesting more wisdom. If I wanted more wisdom, I'll play a balance cleric of 25 Str and 25 Wisdom. But this is a battle cleric who is focus more on fighting than casting. It would be fawking waste of time to bother with 8th and 9th levels spells. Except for Aura vs. Alignment there's nothing on Spell levels 8 and 9 that interest me one bit.

Evidently, NONE of these guys have ever played a battle cleric. A battle cleric keeps his wisdom anywhere from 15 to 19. Battle Clerics do not focus on turn on spell casting. On certain balance clerics and caster clerics have a decent Cha. Real Battle Clerics don't give a flying rat's @$$ about how good they look or their spell ability. To put in short, a battle cleric is wannabe paladin with a greater fighting prowess.
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Quote: Posted 08/09/04 05:22:59 (GMT) -- TyrPaladin
If you change the weapon choice that's fine for your gameplay, but I made those for good reason for gameplay. Monk class offers Evasion and I technically get a 26 Ref save against spells when saving and the highest most spells go is 36 in DC. So all I have to do is roll a 10 and I can evade the attack.

So you took Monk for Evasion. Great. That's all I wanted to know. Not sure what the weapon choice comment was about since I didn't mention that, but whatever.

Quote: People keep suggesting more wisdom. If I wanted more wisdom, I'll play a balance cleric of 25 Str and 25 Wisdom. But this is a battle cleric who is focus more on fighting than casting. It would be fawking waste of time to bother with 8th and 9th levels spells. Except for Aura vs. Alignment there's nothing on Spell levels 8 and 9 that interest me one bit.

Great, your choice, and I'm glad you're happy with it. You want a cleric build that is extremely efficient in melee and doesn't want to have to rely on spells. Again, not sure what this had to do with my post, but whatever.

Quote: Evidently, NONE of these guys have ever played a battle cleric. A battle cleric keeps his wisdom anywhere from 15 to 19. Battle Clerics do not focus on turn on spell casting. On certain balance clerics and caster clerics have a decent Cha. Real Battle Clerics don't give a flying rat's @$$ about how good they look or their spell ability. To put in short, a battle cleric is wannabe paladin with a greater fighting prowess.

Groovy. But "battle cleric" isn't a template or anything. People have different methods of creating something that fulfills that purpose. Me personally, I would choose to have some levels in CoT, since you're not worrying about spell ability that much (except for when you need to lay the smack down with a Word or two). Others seem to be suggesting that some attribute changes might increase the character's versatility by taking advantage of some of the unique aspects of the cleric class (such as spellcasting and access (possibly) to Epic Spells), so that the build won't be just a "wannabe paladin with a greater fighting prowess". Others would say that if you want to play a wannabe paladin, you should just play a paladin. Me, I don't care. Play whatever you want. Just don't attack people for pointing out aspects or possible options you may or may not have considered, when they are just offering to help you tweak and strengthen your build.
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-- Major Garland Briggs, Twin Peaks Just don't attack people for pointing out aspects or possible options you may or may not have considered, when they are just offering to help you tweak and strengthen your build.

Or maybe should try the build before they freaking tweaking. Most of the suggest were made off the top of people's head. Like I told Herbie, try the fawking build you tweak it.
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Click Here TyrPaladin, perhaps you shouldn't be so hostile towards people giving you advice. Then most likely people will treat you much better. I for one post very bluntly towards your posts because you treat others including myself so rudely. You have a habit of thinking any advice on your builds is an attack on you or something. You get extremely defensive, and a useless arguement errupts. You toss around moron and stupid comments when you could simply just say, 'I can see what you are trying to point out, bu my reason was this...'. Also you sit and nitpick people over things like names of builds or taking a level of a class for an ability, instead of saying your piece and being done with it. You do it on this guild's forums, as well as the main bioware forums. It has earned you very little respect from me and as late posting trends seem to show many others. Despite any despise I have towards you for your behavior, I still post giving advice on how to improve your builds, and your ever so kind response is moron this, stupid that. Until you change your behavior, I will post with the same bluntness about your builds. I won't be rude about it. I will just say this could be better, or this is wrong. To be honest I hope you will change your behavior, as I bet a lot of others will then follow in suit.
Quote: Posted 08/09/04 14:13:40 (GMT) -- TyrPaladin

Just don't attack people for pointing out aspects or possible options you may or may not have considered, when they are just offering to help you tweak and strengthen your build.

Or maybe should try the build before they freaking tweaking. Most of the suggest were made off the top of people's head. Like I told Herbie, try the fawking build you tweak it.

Many times, the tweaks have had to be suggested before the build is even playable (such as when feeats or PrCs are taken before prereqs are met or feats are taken twice). Other times, the suggestions people make are rules oriented/nuts-and-bolts suggestions that don't require much play to see and determine. The build may just not be that complex or may be similar to something the author has tried on his/her own before and not posted. Still other times, the suggestions are questions about why the builder chose to take a feat when he/she did or one class instead of another. None of these would require playtesting before suggestion. Most of the problem comes in how you perceive the majority of these suggestions and respond to them. TyrPaladin, perhaps you shouldn't be so hostile towards people giving you advice.

With advice like yours who can't be hostile.

I for one post very bluntly towards your posts because you treat others including myself so rudely.

N****, you ain't special.

You have a habit of thinking any advice on your builds is an attack on you or something.

Quote, “Or maybe should try the build before they freaking tweaking. Most of the suggest were made off the top of people's head. Like I told Herbie, try the fawking build you tweak it.”

The build may just not be that complex or may be similar to something the author has tried on his/her own before and not posted.

Sneaky Wizard anyone?
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Quote: Posted 08/09/04 16:58:46 (GMT) -- TyrPaladin

The build may just not be that complex or may be similar to something the author has tried on his/her own before and not posted.

Sneaky Wizard anyone?

Your response was not, "Why are you taking levels of Shadowdancer? Couldn't you do the same thing just with wizard spells?". Your response was basically, "This build is no better than a rogue with a wand. This build sucks. Any of my builds could whup it at any time." That's not only rude, it's completely unhelpful.

How would you feel if I said, "Your battle cleric build sucks. I could do the same thing -- only better -- with a fighter/weaponmaster with 1 level of bard at the very end to get 43 ranks in Tumble and UMD. It'll be able to cast anything your build can and more, since it could cast 9th level cleric AND wizard spells as well as having better fighting capabilities." Is that helpful? LMAO!!

Wow! In all my time on this earth I have never seen such pettiness! Scratch that! I have: on a grade school playground!

Tyr, i have read your posts/replies to builds over the short time I've been here and PLZ learn about maturity! It is SO unfortunate that you feel that everything is an attack on you. It is even MORE unfortunate to see that you have the need to point out YOUR opinions to SOMEONE's build. It is THEIRS sweety, not yours. So really, besides the minor thoughtless placement of a Feat here or there, there really is NO reason to point out YOUR opinion, cuz opinions sweety are really the cheapest commodities on earth and NO1 really cares (look at the list of ppl postin here love ). Oh, and this whole thing bout "who created the build first blah blah blah!" like the good man said, we only have so many choices! For all you know I may have built EVERY combo in nwn existance so then all YOUR builds would be copys of mine! Oh, cuz they arent posted here doesnt mean they dont exist love! (the internet is a big big place )

SO really, this whole thing comes down to one thing: Tyr grow up and learn to live by the name you call yourself! A paladin would NEVER be so petty to let others get into their heads with mere words! A paladin is much to MATURE for that

BTW, Tyr, i will not respond to anything you have to say.. The fact that a post was startd bout you is MORE than enough proof that you really need to think bout what you are. Sadly, the internet is rampant with ppl who THINK they are great (because in real life they are not). BUT the amazin thing i find is people can't really hide behind who they are! So before you think about attacking me (cuz i know its coming you are way to immature for it to not) STOP and think: avado has given me a chance to grow as a human/elf/dwarf/halfling (what ever you are) and more importantly, as a paladin.

One last thing, you should really stop playin the "uber/fast lvlin" servers. Come to a real server where you have to not only design an epic char, but play it ALL the way through. It is one thing to say "take monk at lv 40 for the ac blah blah". It is an entirely different matter to get that char there! And think bout it: if you did lv to 39, WHY what possible difference could it make to have 1 monk lv at 40? Cuz it looks good on paper? LMAO

To all those NOT Tyr, i think we should all be nice to her. She is a young child who really needs a hug.

Here Tyr, avado *hugs* tyr

There, now im all warm and fuzzy! How bout you?

PEACE .......no.
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Click Here Nice doesn't work either a lot of times. Constructive criticism doesn't. It's only when you point out obvious flaws that needs fixing that you will make any headway. Therefor that's my approach to her builds. If I see an error I'll point it out. If not it can stagnate in the forums. Of course as we all know that still means a lot of posts towards her builds .
Quote: Posted 08/09/04 22:10:29 (GMT) -- Emrill

Nice doesn't work either a lot of times. Constructive criticism doesn't. It's only when you point out obvious flaws that needs fixing that you will make any headway. Therefor that's my approach to her builds. If I see an error I'll point it out. If not it can stagnate in the forums. Of course as we all know that still means a lot of posts towards her builds .

....k.
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Click Here This thread has outlived it's purpose and I'm locking it down. A guildadmin may override this decision.
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