i am trying to think of an interesting build to whoop some rogue/assassin buttocks. i was thinking some sort of monk or ranger where i can bump spot and listen with a useful wis score. perhaps a divine caster? i dunno, the more ideas i have, the more limiting it becomes. just wondering if anyone of our resident rogue-esque-lovers would quickly describe their banes, so that i may seize upon them. obviously a sneak-immune buld also comes to mind, but i would like more of a melee char with natural (skill-based) rogue-detection. spells are okay but they wear off. i want full time. i suppose an elf is also the way to go, for full time searching. any ideas, or thoughts i have yet to cover?
thanks for any and all help.
-c _________________ Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
Here's one: Click Here It's very old, and I've never tested it but I kind of know the creator Check it out
EDIT: oh, you weren't asking for a build eh... well see it for reference
Edited By FinneousPJ on 09/06/05 18:13
thanks fin. that build isn't bad. i am trying to figure out something more on the melee side of things. perhaps something based on a ranger/cleric hybrid. thanks for the input though. any more is greatly appreciated.
-c _________________ "Perception is strong and sight weak. In strategy it is important to see distant things as if they were close and to take a distanced view of close things." - Miyamoto Musashi
10 levels of Pale Master makes you immune to sneak attacks. Also gives you other nice bonuses like AC. You don't have to make much use of the caster portions...could use ranger or cleric if you want for the rest of the levels. Like Ranger(27)/Wizard(3)/PM(10). Then you'd be able to get your spot and listen all the way up as well, since you still need to see them to hit them. But just being able to see them won't help against IKD sneak attacks, so the PM levels help there. Of course if you go cleric instead of ranger, you get True Seeing. Heck, you could go Rogue instead of ranger just to be cruel. You can sneak attack them, but they can't sneak attack you.
Steve
Edited By Stravinsky00 on 09/06/05 21:07
could go a modified variant of the combat medic with str instead of tonnes of wisdom?
-DaMouse
hm... i like the idea of stravinsky's ranger/wiz/pm...i am seeing some interesting possibilities. the only problem in taking rogue is that i can't get a higher bab than 25 probably making the need for dual wield even higher. but perhaps ranger, with BoE, can do alright damage.
perhaps the healer build with a higher strength is a better route, but again i am faced with the problem of a lower bab. i hate to melee without 4 attacks per round. if i took some monk this wouldn't be a problem. thanks damouse.
argh! i just can't seem to find a class mix that seems to fit the bill.
thanks again for all of the ideas. please feel free to give me any others. i appreciate all of them.
thanks!
-c _________________ Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
Edited By christian.schnabel on 09/07/05 02:53
For sheer cheeze factor, an elven bard, rdd palemaster could easily get an AC in the 70's and have enough focus in listen to notice the assasin coming, let the guy miss him in melee and strike him down with a devcrit if he was so inclined.
As I understand it, spot and listen checks are performed once per round, so any rogue or assassin with HiPS would still be able to hide from you. So what you really need is true seeing. Perhaps a druid or cleric with zen archery? Depending on the situation, they may try to run away when they notice they can't sneak up on you, so the disabling spells would probably come i handy too. And if you use druid you can eventually get dragon shape which is sneak immune and has permanent true seeing.
EDIT: Oh you wanted melee, sorry. I wish I'd learn to read the whole thread before posting. A bit of caster for true seeing is probably very good to have however.
Edited By pulse cap on 09/07/05 05:51
i was considering the bardic route as well, but again without a warrior class you are getting 3 attacks per round. haste doesn't last long enough to do the job, and even then with haste items other are still getting another attack per round. but the AC and crit immunity are big factors. so is the fire immunity (no flame weapon damage from UMD scrolls).
true seeing seems to last about 5/10ths of a second. even with high caster levels and extended, it is something that needs to be recast often enough to be annoying. but this is a good solution to hiding foes. *RANT* what is the point of only making skill checks once per round if the hiding continues for the whole round?!? doesn't really seem fair. *END RANT* so then perhaps elves aren't as hot on the spot/listen scene as i thought...
well, i think that these are all good ideas, but i still can't seem to get a good melee build together. perhaps it just isn't going to happen. i suppose that a shifter build, using undead shape, is also a way to go, but that takes a long time. dang it. this is turning out to be harder than i thought (which was pretty hard to begin with).
thanks to Deltutammatre, pulse cap, and all who have done their best to aid me in my plight. any and all other suggestions ideas, criticisms, rants, or whatever are welcome.
-c _________________ "Perception is strong and sight weak. In strategy it is important to see distant things as if they were close and to take a distanced view of close things." - Miyamoto Musashi
Edited By christian.schnabel on 09/07/05 16:32
If you're playing a Cleric, you don't really have to worry about your Base Attack since you have Divine Power. Just in case you failed to notice that
that is a good point, but again we have a limited duration for a spell, this time divine power. but still...seems like a good idea.
-c _________________ "You cannot pass!"
I think I'd go Ranger/Cleric with Animal domain As I understand it checking for sneaky people depends on the highest of Listen and Spot so max out 1 and take 5 in the other for a +2 bonus Animal domain gives you Trueseeing as a 3rd level spell which could be useful Take a 3rd class that gets Uncanny Dodge so that you don't lose your DEX AC bonus if you fail to spot them Defnitely take those sneaky underhand Halflings as a FE _________________ Teaching men a lesson in combat etiquette.
i think this might be the way to go. armor, spells, true seeing. but then again there is a problem with IKD sneaks. but i suppose that with a high discipline, that shouldn't be a problem. halflings are a guaranteed FE. as are...dare i say it...dwarves.
-c _________________ "Perception is strong and sight weak. In strategy it is important to see distant things as if they were close and to take a distanced view of close things." - Miyamoto Musashi
Think I'd choose Bard 4/ Cleric 20/ PaleMaster 16. Sneak immunity, very high ac thanks to the PM levels and the ability to cast in full plate and a shield, very good saves, great buffs all round. Pump a load into Wisdom, Spot, Epic Skill Focus Spot as well as casting True Seeing you should be able to spot most things coming anyway.
Failing that, the cleric has a variety of spells that can reduce said rogue/ assassin to a pile of ash pretty quickly, Destruction and Implosion spring to mind, amongst others. Of course don't forget the touch attack from the Harm Spell, which I believe negates any dodge or dex ac bonuses to land a hit.
Think I'd choose Bard 4/ Cleric 20/ PaleMaster 16. Sneak immunity, very high ac thanks to the PM levels and the ability to cast in full plate and a shield, very good saves, great buffs all round. Pump a load into Wisdom, Spot, Epic Skill Focus Spot as well as casting True Seeing you should be able to spot most things coming anyway.
Failing that, the cleric has a variety of spells that can reduce said rogue/ assassin to a pile of ash pretty quickly, Destruction and Implosion spring to mind, amongst others. Of course don't forget the touch attack from the Harm Spell, which I believe negates any dodge or dex ac bonuses to land a hit.
Actually Dodge and DEX are about the only AC that apply when making touch attacks (along with Deflection). The AC that's ignored is Armor, Natural, and Shield.
So, if trying to land Harm on your opponent, you'll be dealing with their DEX, Dodge, and Deflection AC. _________________ It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!!
You want to melee against a sneaker, huh? How about Champ of Torm 10 (for feats) Wep Master 8 (7 for abilities +1 at 40 to top off spot as a class skill)and Cleric 22? Take knowledge domain for Clairaudience/clairvoiance/true seeing. Add that plus skill focus and epic skill focus in spot and your wis bonus and you should beat their hide. Also trickery domain for improved invis (so they miss you with their sneak if they get lucky). Unlikely that they are crit immune so especially with the cleric buffs and wep master crits, you should tear them. EPic skill focus discipline would solve the IKD problem.
I know you wanted melee, but you can have other kinds of fun. Might even want to fit in zen archery so that when they run, (and they will) you can pop them from a distance. Also, you should have fun sneaking up on them with greater sanc and using harm. Also word of faith then storm of vengence. Sure they will make their save against the lightning, but slowly die thanks to no save vs acid. Or dispell them and have fun with their low fort saves using say slay living or destruction.
Think I'd choose Bard 4/ Cleric 20/ PaleMaster 16. Sneak immunity, very high ac thanks to the PM levels and the ability to cast in full plate and a shield, very good saves, great buffs all round. Pump a load into Wisdom, Spot, Epic Skill Focus Spot as well as casting True Seeing you should be able to spot most things coming anyway.
Failing that, the cleric has a variety of spells that can reduce said rogue/ assassin to a pile of ash pretty quickly, Destruction and Implosion spring to mind, amongst others. Of course don't forget the touch attack from the Harm Spell, which I believe negates any dodge or dex ac bonuses to land a hit.
i want to get 4 attacks per round. not quite doable with this combo. but again very strong in defense with spells and crit immunity.
You want to melee against a sneaker, huh? How about Champ of Torm 10 (for feats) Wep Master 8 (7 for abilities +1 at 40 to top off spot as a class skill)and Cleric 22? Take knowledge domain for Clairaudience/clairvoiance/true seeing. Add that plus skill focus and epic skill focus in spot and your wis bonus and you should beat their hide. Also trickery domain for improved invis (so they miss you with their sneak if they get lucky). Unlikely that they are crit immune so especially with the cleric buffs and wep master crits, you should tear them. EPic skill focus discipline would solve the IKD problem.
I know you wanted melee, but you can have other kinds of fun. Might even want to fit in zen archery so that when they run, (and they will) you can pop them from a distance. Also, you should have fun sneaking up on them with greater sanc and using harm. Also word of faith then storm of vengence. Sure they will make their save against the lightning, but slowly die thanks to no save vs acid. Or dispell them and have fun with their low fort saves using say slay living or destruction.
the only problem is the stat distribution and weapon choice. but i like the concept alot. i think it is either something similar to this, or the ranger/wiz/pm variation.
thanks to all that have added their ideas. it has been a big help.
-c _________________ "Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger."
just a quick update on my progress...
after some rather disappointing testing, i have found that even with true seeing, and a good discipline score, any more than two chars that can sneak deals devastating damage to a char that is not strong enough to resist it.
my results pointed me towards a build with high spot and sneak immunity. this resulted in a number of versions of ranger/wiz/pm that all seemed incredibly underpowered. 3 levels of wiz and 10 levels of pm take away alot from a ranger build, without giving enough arcane punch to make a different. the defense versus offense bugged me a lot. increasing the wizard and pm levels resulted in a still pretty weak build, but slightly better in terms of defense.
also, i have been trying to increase fort to resist a strong paralyzing death attack, but again my results were poor, and could at best only resist weak assassins.
if anyone has any more advice, i would appreciate it. otherwise, i will say that a decent anti-assassin melee char is tricky at best, and at worst impossible.
here are the revised criteria for this build. if anyone thinks they have it solved, please post here or to me privately and let me in on your amazing char mojo.
sneak immunity 40+ AB without spells high ranks in spot (or listen), probably with ESF strong discipline score high-ish fort save (30+ ideally) high-ish AC (high 20's)
any further ideas or comments are welcome.
thanks agian to everyone who has posted here any number of times. your input was much valued.
-c _________________ "Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger."
Edited By christian.schnabel on 09/11/05 02:58
would a bard/PM/Chaampion of Torm work better? something like Bard 8/PM 2/CoT 10 pre-epic for a BAB of 17 Bard gets listen, CoT gets Spot, should be able to maximise 1 of them no trueseeing though _________________ Teaching men a lesson in combat etiquette.
would a bard/PM/Chaampion of Torm work better? something like Bard 8/PM 2/CoT 10 pre-epic for a BAB of 17 Bard gets listen, CoT gets Spot, should be able to maximise 1 of them no trueseeing though
just when i am about to give up hope, ama, you come along and throw me a whole heap of it.
i think this might be the way to go...
ye have my hearty thanks...
-c _________________ "Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement."
well I don't think your AB will be great but you should manage the other requirements ok glad if its helped _________________ Teaching men a lesson in combat etiquette.
His AB can still be quite good, why not? He needs CHA somewhat, but not to much, and then he can bomb STR or DEX, whichever he wants for AB, depending on his preferences. His AB can easily be up close to builds without RDD or WM. So your suggestion is better than you think, that's why you'renamed Queen perhaps.
Grim
Maybe start with STR 16 DEX 10 CON 14 INT 14 WIS 08 CHA 14 Pump STR all the way Assuming WF, EWF and Epic Prowess that'll be an AB of +39 at level 40 without buffs, song, items etc _________________ Teaching men a lesson in combat etiquette.
quite right grimnir. i have done some quick testing, and this looks promising.
amazon queen, those are the stats as i see them. the hard part seems to be skills. this rogue suffers from low-skill-point-syndrome, but we shall see what can be done about that.
thanks. with any luck, you guys will see a build up shortly.
-c _________________ "Perception is strong and sight weak. In strategy it is important to see distant things as if they were close and to take a distanced view of close things." - Miyamoto Musashi
Maybe start with STR 16 DEX 10 CON 14 INT 14 WIS 08 CHA 14 Pump STR all the way Assuming WF, EWF and Epic Prowess that'll be an AB of +39 at level 40 without buffs, song, items etc
AB should be better than that, depending on how many GRT STR are taken. I'd go with at least 4, so taking that as the baseline, your final STR would be 30. Your pre-epic BAB is +17, so with WF, EWF, and EP, your total unbuffed AB would be:
27 (base) + 10 (STR) + 4 (WF, EWF, EP) = +41. Not too bad.
Just a note, I'd probably aim for Bard 12/PM 10/CoT 18. Should be good saves, enough feats, and some decent Bard Song. Another consideration would be Bard 14/PM 16/CoT 10. You could max Listen (Bard skill), have good Bard Song boost, and an epic spell (Epic Warding, anyone?) You'd also have a quite impressive AC (+10 from PM). Saves would be (before modifiers and feats are added/subtracted):
Fort: 27 Refl: 28 Will: 27
with the B 8/PM 10/CoT 18 build, you'd have +4 to all the saves. Hmmm, of course, you're immune to paralysis and sneak attack, so the saves aren't that big a cncern are they? _________________ It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!!
i have just posted my idea. your suggestions are good and worthwhile, but i just finished making this one, so perhaps you can post these ideas at the bottom. thanks!
-c _________________ "Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger."
Edited By christian.schnabel on 09/12/05 05:08
I wonder if you'd consider using an Arcane Archer. I know it isn't melee but they get both Listen and Spot for their class skills. Since I finally got into this guild and you had me thinking about this, i came up with The Wise and Alert Archer build which is my first build here Click Here
If you don't like it and you wanna stick with a meleer, i see you've already picked up on the Ranger bit with the FEs.
Edited By Jennalee on 09/13/05 11:50
Ok so you want 4 attacks per round? Heard of Divine Power? and don't forget Haste if you take Travel Domain.
As well as that consider the War Domain, which increases your attack and damage still further, as well as the wonderful Spell Aura of Vitality.
BAB can reach well into the 60s, thanks to GMW, Bulls Strength, Divine Power, Divine Favour, Aura of Vitality, etc. Of course, if you concentrate on taking increasing Strength every chance you get, this will only help it further.
Think I'd choose Bard 4/ Cleric 20/ PaleMaster 16. Sneak immunity, very high ac thanks to the PM levels and the ability to cast in full plate and a shield, very good saves, great buffs all round. Pump a load into Wisdom, Spot, Epic Skill Focus Spot as well as casting True Seeing you should be able to spot most things coming anyway.
Failing that, the cleric has a variety of spells that can reduce said rogue/ assassin to a pile of ash pretty quickly, Destruction and Implosion spring to mind, amongst others. Of course don't forget the touch attack from the Harm Spell, which I believe negates any dodge or dex ac bonuses to land a hit.
i want to get 4 attacks per round. not quite doable with this combo. but again very strong in defense with spells and crit immunity.
Ok so you want 4 attacks per round? Heard of Divine Power? and don't forget Haste if you take Travel Domain.
...
yes i have heard of divine power. unfortunately, divine power as a limited duration. i prefer, when making melee builds, to have a natural bab of above 15. otherwise, i will go for a dual wield, just to get more unbuffed attacks per round. as cleric levels increase, and if you extend divine power, it can become very powerful, but by that point everyone is very powerful. this is a good suggestion, but not quite what i had in mind. but a very important note for those with a bab below 16 and with some room for cleric in their build. thanks for the advice.
-c
Quote: Posted 09/13/05 11:45:50 (GMT) -- Jennalee
I wonder if you'd consider using an Arcane Archer. I know it isn't melee but they get both Listen and Spot for their class skills. Since I finally got into this guild and you had me thinking about this, i came up with The Wise and Alert Archer build which is my first build here Click Here
If you don't like it and you wanna stick with a meleer, i see you've already picked up on the Ranger bit with the FEs.
i actually had considered going to an archer, but that seemed too easy. i always do things the hard way. must be a brain malfunction. arcane archers, who can combine arcane might with ranged prowess, make for some powerful rogue stoppers. good point, and worth investigation (which you already did). thanks for the idea.
-c
Well while I was still thinking on this, I thought something more along the lines of an elven Ranger/CoT with 14 Wis and taking plenty of FEs for their bonus skill checks not just damage and bane, dual-wielding maybe with a two-bladed sword (large weapon?), improved disarm and with dev crit and ESF in either Listen or Spot. CoT gets save bonuses (jack that Fort save up most importantly) and Spot as a class skill. I guess you've got a lot of people thinking and I'm quite new to this (some builds already posted). Even better (if managable) put in some stealth xD. Sneaky-types don't usually have high wisdom scores and don't invest heavily in listen/spot. Use their own tactics against them >:).
This is what I came up with with that combo (as you can see, I'm not too good at building meleers but I suppose it gets the job done):
Race: Elf (probably is a much much better idea to use a Dwarf or Human) Alignment: Lawful Good
Stats: STR: 16(26) - need more bonus feats... DEX: 15 CON: 12 INT: 13 WIS: 12(14) CHA: 8
01: Ranger(1): Power Attack, Favored Enemy: Humans, R: (Dual Wield) 02: Ranger(2) 03: Ranger(3): Weapon Proficiency Exotic 04: Ranger(4): STR+1, (STR=17) 05: Ranger(5): Favored Enemy: Halflings 06: Ranger(6): Weapon Focus: Two-Bladed Sword 07: Ranger(7) 08: Champion of Torm(1): STR+1, (STR=18) 09: Champion of Torm(2): Ambidexterity, Cleave 10: Ranger(8) 11: Champion of Torm(3): CT: (Smite Evil) 12: Champion of Torm(4): STR+1, Two-Weapon Fighting, Great Cleave, (STR=19) 13: Ranger(9): R: (Improved Two-Weapon Fighting) 14: Champion of Torm(5) 15: Champion of Torm(6): Blind Fight, Improved Critical: Two-Bladed Sword 16: Ranger(10): STR+1, Favored Enemy: Elves, (STR=20) 17: Champion of Torm(7) 18: Champion of Torm(8): Toughness, Disarm 19: Champion of Torm(9) 20: Champion of Torm(10): STR+1, Improved Disarm, (STR=21) 21: Champion of Torm(11): Great Strength I, (STR=22) 22: Champion of Torm(12) 23: Champion of Torm(13) 24: Champion of Torm(14): STR+1, Great Strength II, Epic Weapon Focus: Two-Bladed Sword, (STR=24) 25: Champion of Torm(15) 26: Ranger(11) 27: Ranger(12): Overwhelming Critical: Two-Bladed Sword 28: Ranger(13): STR+1, (STR=25) 29: Ranger(14) 30: Ranger(15): Devastating Critical: Two-Bladed Sword, Favored Enemy: Dwarves 31: Ranger(16) 32: Ranger(17): WIS+1, (WIS=13) 33: Ranger(18): Epic Fortitude 34: Ranger(19) 35: Champion of Torm(16) 36: Ranger(20): WIS+1, Epic Skill Focus: Spot, Epic Prowess, (WIS=14) 37: Rogue(1) <-- XP penalty 20% starts here >.<, dump 40 into Tumble 38: Champion of Torm(17) 39: Ranger(21): Bane of Enemies 40: Champion of Torm(18): STR+1, Armor Skin, (STR=26)
Max HP: 476 AB (mundane two-bladed sword): 40? *sniffle* Attacks (main-hand): 1d8 +8, +40/ +35/ +30/ +25 Attacks (off-hand): 1d8 +4, +40/ +35 Also add 2d6 Bane damage and I think, +5 from normal FE (heh now I don't think I'm doing too badly actually)
Skills (183 only to spend): Discipline: 43(51) Tumble: 40(42) Concentration: 42(43) Spot: 43(57) + FE bonuses against chosen races
+ 15 extra (I put these into Heal)
Level 4 Ranger spells
Since no class gets Great STR as a bonus feat, I can easily see why Fighters/CoT get so many bonus feats - they're REALLY needed at epic levels if you want to put STR up to extraordinary levels which a melee char could really use. I'm hoping the two-bladed sword counts as a large weapon when using Disarm. I think Keen Senses could easily be traded off for more CON (and HP/Fort) and in the end, more STR.
Edited By Jennalee on 09/14/05 13:13
Quote: Posted 09/14/05 12:50:06 (GMT) -- Jennalee
...
AC (naked/Tower Shield + Chainmail): 22/30
...
just a quick note to mention. if you use a towershield, you can't use the two-bladed sword. if wear any medium armor then you lose the bonuses of dual-wield. this can obviously be compensated for by making use of a slashing weapon and blade thirst with the chain and shield, or casting cat's grace and wearing light armor with the two-bladed sword.
very nice though. i like the versatility.
-c _________________ "Perception is strong and sight weak. In strategy it is important to see distant things as if they were close and to take a distanced view of close things." - Miyamoto Musashi
Woopsies on the shield but he gets normal Ambi and TWF during the CoT levels which were timed so he'd get them then bonus ITWF from Ranger so he should do fine in medium armor (unless it's bugged and Dual-Wield takes precedence). Yup he can make use of spells/other stat boosters and wear light armor too if the situation requires.
Why would anyone want an anti-assassin build? That seems a bit prejudice, methinks. Why not anti-wizards and sorcs? They have all the power. Don't pick on wimpy wittle assassins who have like one tiny little power. _________________ Got Hommlet? World of Greyhawk Action Server (with 1/2 price ales on Mondays!)
Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
Aren't there a lot of good spellsword builds centered around nuking mages already? That archer build I posted might do OK against wizzies but maxed IGMS is EVIL. Mages look wimpy on paper - I mean 1d4 HP pff die already *bonks with saucepan and gets hit with reciprocal damage and dies x_x* (and I've never played an arcane-caster) but going against that demi-lich in HoTU taught me otherwise. He would NOT die. I died so many times against him but at least his AI isn't great so he didn't rebuff when I dispelled him. I don't even want to think of what a real player could do >.< especially with that omg overpowered epic warding/epic mage armor.
I wouldn't really know on how to go about an anti-caster. Mages even kill each other fairly easily so what chance does a non-mage who isn't like pure monk have
That was just a bit of tongue-and-cheek, on my part, lassie. I wasn't actually wanting an anti-caster build. I was merely defending the honour of the noble assassin class. _________________ Got Hommlet? World of Greyhawk Action Server (with 1/2 price ales on Mondays!)
Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
Yes very 'noble' =P. I do kinda agree with you though. They're a bit wimpy for a prestige class. A special sneak attack that can only fire off twice a round and 4 skill points per level .
Why would anyone want an anti-assassin build? That seems a bit prejudice, methinks. Why not anti-wizards and sorcs? They have all the power. Don't pick on wimpy wittle assassins who have like one tiny little power.
i was wondering when our resident head of the dwarven assassins guild would voice his concerns. well, you have little to feat from me and my builds, but as for cin and jen...how many cure potions did you have?
-c _________________ Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
Why would anyone want an anti-assassin build? That seems a bit prejudice, methinks. Why not anti-wizards and sorcs? They have all the power. Don't pick on wimpy wittle assassins who have like one tiny little power.
Thats why we build Blackguards, Grizz, to defend those noble assassins from those anti-assassins.
Why would anyone want an anti-assassin build? That seems a bit prejudice, methinks. Why not anti-wizards and sorcs? They have all the power. Don't pick on wimpy wittle assassins who have like one tiny little power.
i was wondering when our resident head of the dwarven assassins guild would voice his concerns. well, you have little to feat from me and my builds, but as for cin and jen...how many cure potions did you have?
i was wondering when our resident head of the dwarven assassins guild would voice his concerns. well, you have little to feat from me and my builds, but as for cin and jen...how many cure potions did you have?
-c
That sounds like some sort of challenge. Experience is the best teacher I suppose, so might as well put these so-called anti-assassin builds to a real test. Let's see what they're made of. I'll take one of my Assassins, and you take one of your anti-assassins, and we'll meet at my IP address. Last one standing has bragging rights. _________________ Got Hommlet? World of Greyhawk Action Server (with 1/2 price ales on Mondays!)
Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
Well, I went to your IP address, but I forgot to cross-class points into Open Lock, so I couldn't get in... _________________ It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!!
LOL
I intended those character builds to be general anti-rogue/things that hide in shadows characters, not to specifically beat The Assassin King.
Things that hide in shadows tend to wield small, pointy weapons, dual wield, get epic dodge, surprise and backstab to make you die quickly then hide again and a lot get SC V. BTW, I tend to like playing said hide in shadows thingies than brutish tanks. It must be something about standing in the midst of like, 100 fireballs and taking 0 damage xD.
Anyhow how Cinn can go for me *no experience of PvP in NWN*
Quote: Posted 09/17/05 05:20:11 (GMT) -- Cinnabar Din
Well, I went to your IP address, but I forgot to cross-class points into Open Lock, so I couldn't get in...
Yeah, actually I can't get in myself. Has something to do with my settings and what not, and rather than try to figure it out, I'd just rather try to connect to someone else's. _________________ Got Hommlet? World of Greyhawk Action Server (with 1/2 price ales on Mondays!)
Ariel, Ookla, RIDE!
I never knew such a nice fuzz-beard such was so inclined to sowing the seeds of darkness .
*can almost hear that evil talking sword telling us his preferred choice of breakfast beverage*
Check it out 
You want to melee against a sneaker, huh? How about Champ of Torm 10 (for feats) Wep Master 8 (7 for abilities +1 at 40 to top off spot as a class skill)and Cleric 22? Take knowledge domain for Clairaudience/clairvoiance/true seeing. Add that plus skill focus and epic skill focus in spot and your wis bonus and you should beat their hide. Also trickery domain for improved invis (so they miss you with their sneak if they get lucky). Unlikely that they are crit immune so especially with the cleric buffs and wep master crits, you should tear them. EPic skill focus discipline would solve the IKD problem.
Click Here
need more bonus feats...
