I have never played a cleric type (I have tested some cleric zen archers, but not more) and I wish to start one.
The plan is playing a cleric on a low magic (I'm not sure when a server really a low magic server, this one has very few +5 items for level 20+ characters) PW with very low advancement.
My plan is to make an effective fighter/caster who could survive most situations along his career, deal good melee damage and still being able to buff and kill creatures with spells when his melee isn't effective. I try to max his fighting skills before because resting (at the wilderness) costs money (because you need camp kits) in that server and, at early levels money is very scarce, so I start as a fighter and then turn into a cleric.
He is mostly for PvM (It's a RP server with full PvP so I can avoid PvPing if I am enough diplomatic. ).
This is the build I came with: Note: The skills are in intervals of 5 in order to improve readability.
Human Cleric 20/Fighter 10/CoT 10
Starting stats: STR: 16 (26) DEX: 8 //I can always drop a cat's grace CON: 12 WIS: 16 (20) INT: 14 CHA: 8
Domains: Trickery/Magic (There are few haste items so travel could be a good option, but I plan having a haste item someday and magic has nice spells IMHO).
Final skills: Disable Trap 10(12) Open Lock 13(12) //I wont need a rogue for low level chests, plus, with trickery I can boost this and open most of the chests I will find in my PW Discipline 42(50) Concentration 43(44) Spellcraft 43(45) Tumble 20(19) //I still have 1 skillpoint I dont know where to place
Unbuffed Saves: Note: (43 spellcraft, 45 with stats, I assume a +9 bonus) Fort: 31 (40) Will: 29 (38) Reflex: 23 (32)
If so, which one is better? - Drop Armor skin and one Great Wisdom or great Str in order to get 22 cleric levels and epic spell penetration? - Take 9 pre-epic levels (instead of 7) dropping Thoughness/maximize spell (and 1 AB) and trading 1 great wisdom for epic spell penetration?
I mean, is it that useful?
What do you guys think? Is it good enough? Do you know anything that could help me improving him?
P.S.: It is almost sure the PW where I play wont have CoT, so mine will be Cleric 20/Ftr 20. I did put the CoT here to make it more good looking and even usable for others if they like it. It's easy to go dwarf with this one, It's enough with taking weapon focus at level 3 forgetting thoughness (you already have a bonus to const, so it is also a +1 to fort saves) and investing half skillpoints into unlock and untrap. _________________ Over Seven Years of High Quality RP. www.mytharria.org We offer a unique world with player based religions & governments.
Edited By fernandooa on 06/21/05 08:25
Without really checking your build to good, I can say this; Take your CoT levs epic, and you can use the bonus feats from it to take Great wisdom, saves some ability gains to put in strength, and that will boost attack and damage. Didn't study your feats to good, but it should be doable. will not affect overall build, remember CoT also gives you EWS.
Unless you picked animal or war domain, you won't be able to buff your DEX via cats. _________________ Inactive for a while
Thanks for the feedback.
About the CoT levels epic, that would hurt the AB slighly... Moving 4 cleric to pre-epic (and CoT to epic) and trading the spell penetrations for great wisdoms (Extra CoT feats) would allow me to take 2 more great str and make the AB to not to change. True enough. Thanks a lot.
About the Cat's grace. I didn't know about that. I should have to check the Plant domain (and compare it to Magic), on the worst case I think I can live without that 2 AC or rely on items or potions. _________________ Over Seven Years of High Quality RP. www.mytharria.org We offer a unique world with player based religions & governments.
About the CoT levels epic, that would hurt the AB slighly...
Not necessarily, you can switch fighter and CoT levels. _________________ I generally avoid temptation, unless I can't resist it...
I'm already taking great wis as CoT epic feat, the problem is that, with two "main" stats (abilities), it is hard to invest in both. .
I made a new version:
Cleric(20), Fighter(10), Champion of Torm(10), Human
01: Fighter(1): Weapon Focus: Greatsword, Power Attack, Cleave, Disable Trap(2), Discipline(4), Open Lock(2) 02: Fighter(2): Knockdown 03: Fighter(3): Blind Fight 04: Fighter(4): STR+1, Weapon Specialization: Greatsword, (STR=17) 05: Cleric(1) 06: Cleric(2): Extend Spell 07: Cleric(3): Concentration(10), Spellcraft(10), Tumble(5) 08: Champion of Torm(1): STR+1, (STR=18) 09: Champion of Torm(2): Improved Knockdown, Improved Critical: Greatsword 10: Cleric(4): Discipline(5) 11: Cleric(5) 12: Cleric(6): STR+1, Combat Casting, (STR=19) 13: Cleric(7) 14: Cleric(8): Spellcraft(5) 15: Cleric(9): Empower Spell 16: Cleric(10): STR+1, (STR=20) 17: Cleric(11): Concentration(10), Tumble(5) 18: Cleric(12): Great Cleave 19: Champion of Torm(3): Disable Trap(5), Open Lock(5), Spellcraft(5) 20: Fighter(5): STR+1, (STR=21), Discipline(5) 21: Fighter(6): Epic Weapon Focus: Greatsword, Epic Weapon Specialization: Greatsword, Discipline(10) 22: Fighter(7) 23: Fighter(8): Epic Prowess 24: Fighter(9): STR+1, Great Strength I, (STR=23) 25: Champion of Torm(4): Overwhelming Critical: Greatsword 26: Champion of Torm(5) 27: Champion of Torm(6): Great Strength II, Great Wisdom I, (STR=24), (WIS=17), Tumble(5) 28: Fighter(10): STR+1, Devastating Critical: Greatsword, (STR=25), Discipline(5) 29: Champion of Torm(7): Open Lock(3) 30: Champion of Torm(8): Great Strength III, Great Wisdom II, (STR=26), (WIS=18) 31: Cleric(13): Concentration(10), Spellcraft(10) 32: Cleric(14): WIS+1, (WIS=19), Spellcraft(5) 33: Cleric(15): Great Strength IV, (STR=27) 34: Cleric(16) 35: Cleric(17) 36: Cleric(18): WIS+1, Great Strength V, (STR=28), (WIS=20) 37: Cleric(19): Concentration(10), Spellcraft(5), Tumble(5) 38: Champion of Torm(9): Discipline(5), Open Lock(1) 39: Champion of Torm(10): Great Strength VI, Armor Skin, (STR=29), Discipline(8) 40: Cleric(20): STR+1, (STR=30), Concentration(3), Spellcraft(3)
I dropped: - Toughness (Maximized endurance adds enough HP -and fort saves- on top of your 400 HP). - Spell penetration and Epic spell penetration (If you can't go through their SR they should fall to your sword, else dont attack him, he is a DM ). - Combat Casting (Removing the -4 concentration penalty isn't very useful for a build that will not use many attack spells)
Got 4 Great Strength features for them.
His saves (unbuffed) are slighly different: Fort: 31 Will: 30 Ref: 22
His AB is better: (Unbuffed) AB: 27(Base) + 10(str) +1(WF) +2(EWF) +1(Epic Prowess) = 41AB (unbuffed) (was 40) His damage is (slighly) better: 2d6 +15(10str * 1.5) +2(WS) +4(EWS) = 2d6 +21 (unbuffed) (was 2d6 +18) His dev.crit. DC is now 40 (unbuffed) (was 38)
His unbuffed HP is now a max of 400 (was 440).
I'm still in doubt with the cat's grace, I think this build can perform good enough without it (His naked AC is 15, and you can always find a +dex item or cat's grace potion)
I do prefer this version What do you guys think? _________________ Over Seven Years of High Quality RP. www.mytharria.org We offer a unique world with player based religions & governments.
Edited By fernandooa on 06/22/05 09:50
your last build is better. Here is my melee cleric build: Click Here
I'm not saying this is better, but it is different. check it and tell me what you think.
I like your build, he is much of a character designed to be able to take damage while he can cast a few buffs or even offensive spells. And he will be GREAT in a PW with Dev.Crit. disabled. (If I ever design str a melee build without Dev.Crit. I will give him a scythe ). The only thing I miss on him is IKD, I have found it to be terribly useful, even when you are trying to be deffensive (Always one of my melee tanks tries to hold an enemy while the magic casters fry it I use knockdown constantly on him. While the enemy is down he cant harm anybody nor run anywhere ).
Mine is more goes more for the offensive Melee character (IKD, Dev. Crit.) with buffs who is able to cast a few nice spells if his melee skills aren't strong enough (Harm/Mass Heal, Implosion or even a Storm of vengeance to soften a room).
Thanks for the comments, I think he is quite round right now. I'm wondering if I should name give him and place it in the Character Builds thread. _________________ Over Seven Years of High Quality RP. www.mytharria.org We offer a unique world with player based religions & governments.
Hmm, many immune to KD items on the server, but KD can be taken at 18, and i think Dev crit can be worked in. Your build seems quite complete, because as with all clerics, the few BAB you lack from cleric levs is regained with the divine power spell. I have found this type of builds to be somewhat effective vs mages even, nice saves, some sr, and enough heals and hp to wear out the mage. With heal domain you have access to heal on two different caster levs. AC is the downside on my build, and also with yours. I can see no way to improve on it without compromising to much of the build. And you should post it, it is a good build IMO.
). The only thing I miss on him is IKD, I have found it to be terribly useful, even when you are trying to be deffensive (Always one of my melee tanks tries to hold an enemy while the magic casters fry it I use knockdown constantly on him. While the enemy is down he cant harm anybody nor run anywhere 
or even a Storm of vengeance to soften a room).