Feats: Uncanny Dodge I Poison Save I Ghostly Visage Power Attack
__Level 19____________________
Class: Assassin Hit points: 5
Skills: Hide: +3 Move Silently: +3
Feats: Death Attack (+2d6)
__Level 20____________________
Class: Assassin Hit points: 3 Ability gain: Strength +1
Skills: Hide: +4 Move Silently: +4
Feats: Poison Save II
__Level 21____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 9
Skills: Discipline: +5
Feats: Epic Character Epic Weapon Master Great Strength I
__Level 22____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 5
Skills: Discipline: +1
__Level 23____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 8
Skills: Discipline: +1
Feats: Epic Superior Weapon Focus Epic Weapon Focus (longsword)
__Level 24____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 5 Ability gain: Strength +1
Skills: Discipline: +1
Feats: Cleave
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 5
Skills: Discipline: +1
__Level 26____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 9
Skills: Discipline: +1 Lore: +10
Feats: Epic Prowess
__Level 27____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 6
Skills: Discipline: +1
Feats: Great Cleave
__Level 28____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 7 Ability gain: Strength +1
Skills: Discipline: +1
__Level 29____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 8
Skills:
Feats: Overwhelming Critical (longsword)
__Level 30____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 9
Skills: Discipline: +2
Feats: Great Strength II
__Level 31____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 5
Skills: Discipline: +1
__Level 32____________________
Class: Assassin Hit points: 3 Ability gain: Strength +1
Skills: Hide: +11 Move Silently: +11 Tumble: +15
Feats: Uncanny Dodge II Death Attack (+3d6)
Darkness
__Level 33____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 5
Skills: Discipline: +2
Feats: Devastating Critical longsword (Won't work on server in mind) Great Strength III
__Level 34____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 6
Skills: Discipline: +1
__Level 35____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 8
Skills: Discipline: +1
__Level 36____________________
Class: Fighter Hit points: 5 Ability gain: Strength +1
Skills: Discipline: +1
Feats: Epic Weapon Specialization (longsword)
__Level 37____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 9
Skills: Discipline: +1
Feats: Armor Skin
__Level 38____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 5
Skills: Discipline: +1
__Level 39____________________
Class: Assassin Hit points: 3
Skills: Hide: +11 Move Silently: +11 Tumble: +5
Feats: Poison Save III Great Strength IV
__Level 40____________________
Class: Weapon Master Hit points: 8 Ability gain: Strength +1
Skills: Discipline: +2 Lore: +6
This is for a high magic world, The low will save being something counterable through gear, or at least taking the loss of will save off. My first though is to take less Assassin pre-epic to get a higher BAB. And Dev crit is a banned feat, so I was thinking epic fire resistance(Lessen the effect of darkfire when used by enemies.) _________________ ~Nightfall
"If they live long enough get the opportunity to hit you back you are doing something wrong" ~The Justicar
Hard to read outline but, more importantly, why don't you use rogue?
You'll get more skillpoints, UMD, sneaks (and just about everything the assassin will give you and Imp. Evasion and slippery mind to help with your will saves) and your death attack DC won't be high anyhow since you're taking mainly WM levels. Also, drop your starting STR to 16 and get your CON up since it's a melee build. That high STR you used your starting points to buy isn't worth the low HP and dying fast. _________________ .:\_/:. Only those who have known darkness in (OvO) their hearts will see the shadows in life... (|__|) ..".."..
Assassin gets UMD and tumble as class skills, and a few innate spells that can be pretty useful (darkness, improved invisibility, even the humble ghostly visage).
I don't understand why you aren't using an assassin level late in the build to max UMD, or tumble for AC purposes. It's as much as +8 AC. Very worthwhile.
I also think that since you're a strength fighter with epic specialization and WM levels, you should switch to a weapon with better critical characteristics than the longsword. Scimitar or rapier, depending on if slashing or piercing is better in your environment. Going from a 1d8 to a 1d6 weapon only costs 1 point of average damage per hit, but the extra critical damage will more than make up for that. _________________ Experience is the mother of good judgement; bad judgement is the father of experience.
I guess, for him, it may be that longswords are more easily obtainable than Scims but otherwise, a Scim or Rapier would be much preferred.
Rogues get more skillpoints. They can also get Imp. Evasion and Slippery Mind which will help with will saves if there's no mind immunity items around. _________________ .:\_/:. Only those who have known darkness in (OvO) their hearts will see the shadows in life... (|__|) ..".."..
Quote: Posted 10/29/05 12:10:14 (GMT) -- Jennalee
Hard to read outline but, more importantly, why don't you use rogue?
You'll get more skillpoints, UMD, sneaks (and just about everything the assassin will give you and Imp. Evasion and slippery mind to help with your will saves) and your death attack DC won't be high anyhow since you're taking mainly WM levels. Also, drop your starting STR to 16 and get your CON up since it's a melee build. That high STR you used your starting points to buy isn't worth the low HP and dying fast.
Reasoning is thusly: 1.) It's a high magic world, I will hit the +12 magical cap with both STR and INT once gear is on and its at or above level 30. While the Death attack DC wouldn't be great, I't be at bare minimum 10 + 8(6 int mod boost, 2 natural Mod) + 6 (Class level) totaling: DC 24. Nothing spectacualar, But rolling a 1 is still a *CENSORED*.
2.) As I said high magical world, in every sense, I'm picking up +20 hide and move from a cloak(He can effectively sneak in full plate). As I said STR, and INT will both hit teh magical cap, and I know CON will pick up at least a +4 magical modifier. While I didn't max roll his HP for testing purposes, I will when puch comes to shove but he hit 338 without max rolling.
Sitting down and looking at the divide, he turned out at lvl 6 Fighter, 6 Assassin, 28 Weapons Master.
Assassin gets UMD and tumble as class skills, and a few innate spells that can be pretty useful (darkness, improved invisibility, even the humble ghostly visage).
I don't understand why you aren't using an assassin level late in the build to max UMD, or tumble for AC purposes. It's as much as +8 AC. Very worthwhile.
I also think that since you're a strength fighter with epic specialization and WM levels, you should switch to a weapon with better critical characteristics than the longsword. Scimitar or rapier, depending on if slashing or piercing is better in your environment. Going from a 1d8 to a 1d6 weapon only costs 1 point of average damage per hit, but the extra critical damage will more than make up for that.
Bingo on the demi-spell book. Invis, and imp invis (If I take him high enough) can really add some whallop to this concept and execution. Darkness... Fighting in side it causes -every- Attack to be considered a death attack (Minus the Suprise Paralyze bonus) effectively its a way to ensure sneak attacks.
As far as boosting tumble in late levels. That's easy, because I maxed it by the 5's As I went, so going form lvl 38 -> 39, his tumble went form 35 to 40.
Crit range... such a lovely topic... I've always prefered the longsword for teh simple reason that it is suppose to be the staple of your everyday average fighter. It's also the better choice simple put when it comes down to gear. I must seem like I'm writing off a lot of things that way, but its quite true, let's just say I have a sword that outdoes any Scimitar in the module. It was custom made and imported by a DM, there are no weapons with a damage yeild as high as the one I have. Side by side with my buddy the Bard/RDD/WM with a Scimitar; he was hitting an average of 230 crits, a high of 274. I was hitting 250-ish, high of 292.
I guess what I really oughta be asking, Is WM Vs Assassin. Where should I draw the line? And is it worth it to loose the BAB by taking assassin Pre-epic? _________________ ~Nightfall
"Hard pressed on my right. My center is yielding. Impossible to maneuver. Situation excellent. I am attacking." ~Ferdinand Foch At the Battle of the Marne
Ah, well if you have a super longsword, that's that.
As for assassin vs WM... I'd go with WM since you're a strength build with specialization. You don't need sneak attack dice to butcher things, and the extremely pumped up AB you'll have in the end will let you fight with Power Attack on for more damage, or Expertise on for more defense, or to leverage Improved Knockdown and Called Shot heavily in your favor.
A build like 11 fighter/19 WM/10 assassin would net you +3 to your weapon of choice AB, 5d6 bonus damage from sneak attack, and plenty of fighter bonus feats while letting you do 10 fighter/10 WM to 20 for maximum BAB. You take the 11th fighter level at 24 for EWS.
Alternately you could do fighter 10/11 assassin/19 WM for 6d6 sneak attacks if you'd rather, at the cost of 1 point of BAB. 4 assassin 6 fighter 10 WM to 20.
Or fighter 8/WM 22/assassin 10. This would also be fighter 6 assassin 4 WM 10 to level 20, letting you get some assassin levels early. Then you make up the lost AB point with an extra WM epic weapon of choice bonus, and gain an epic WM bonus feat.
Lots of good options there, the first choice maximizes your combat feats (making it easy for you to pick up improved knockdown or called shot) and maintains your BAB, the second choice mixes a little extra sneak attack damage dice with early assassin, at the cost of a little AB. The third variant lets you take assassin early without sacrificing AB compared to the others, and trades a non-epic fighter feat for an epic WM feat.
I think it's very viable to go with option 2, since you'll have AB in abundance. But you'll also have damage in abundance, you don't really need the sneak attacks. I'd pick between 2 and 3 depending on the feats you want. _________________ Experience is the mother of good judgement; bad judgement is the father of experience.
Or fighter 8/WM 22/assassin 10. This would also be fighter 6 assassin 4 WM 10 to level 20, letting you get some assassin levels early. Then you make up the lost AB point with an extra WM epic weapon of choice bonus, and gain an epic WM bonus feat.
The third variant lets you take assassin early without sacrificing AB compared to the others, and trades a non-epic fighter feat for an epic WM feat.
so go 6 ftr, 10 WM, 4 AS, to hit 20, Then Tack on 12WM, 2 FTR, 6 AS, to hit 40 I take it?
I don't suppose you have a work up on that handy? I'm actually gonna go make my own I think so I hav a solid plan to look at. _________________
Quote: You shouldn't be offended by this; by hacker standards, your respondent is showing you a rough kind of respect simply by not ignoring you.
Migrating Traps U: 10May08
I don't have a specific levelup for that build handy, no... just some brainstorming on options I'd take within your build specifications.
I'm actually not the biggest fan of strength weaponmasters... I feel the character ends up being too narrowly focused. Adding assassin for the spell like abilities and skill dump opportunities brings a lot to the build, I think. Maybe I'll try to make one up in detail when I have time later. _________________ Experience is the mother of good judgement; bad judgement is the father of experience.
I did a quick build based on Xylo's suggestions
Weapon Master 22/ Assassin 10/ Fighter 8
Dwarf, any evil
STR 16 (26) CON 17 (22) DEX 14 INT 14 WIS 8 CHA 6
HP: 640 SkP: 192 BAB: 29 AB: 46 AC (naked/plate and tower shield): 22/32
SAVES (vs spell) For 25 (31) Ref 25 (31) Will 15 (21)
Nothing special maybe, but looks usable. I went for EDR and higher CON for survivability and anyhow Dev Crit is switched off on your server. Hope you enjoy it
Cheers, Kail _________________ Dilegua notte Tramontate stelle Tramontate stelle All'alba vinceṛ Vinceṛ Vinceṛ
Here's one i worked on last night (I've been working on one of this type for a while now) which I think you might like. It's a utility Rogue/Fighter/WM build, for comparison with the above.
BTW, 11 CON is NOTHING to write home about, especially on a melee character.
The Versatile Weaponmaster - Rogue 13/ Fighter 8/ WM 19
Max HP: 528 BAB: 29 AB (mundane longsword): 46 AC (naked/full plate + tower shield): 21/32
Saves: Fort: 26 Ref: 24 Will: 19
+4 vs. Spells
Skills (311 skillpoints): Discipline: 43(52) Tumble: 40(41) Spellcraft: 18(20) <-- +4 saves vs. spells UMD: 41(40) <-- works in multiples of 5 Heal: 43(42) Spot: 43(42)
Intimidate: 4
Search: 20(22) <-- find all non-epic traps Disable Trap: 14(16) <-- disable all non-epic traps with take-20 Open Lock: 26(27) Pick Pocket: 1(2) <-- lets you loot dead bodies
Gets decent HPs, a bucketload of skillpoints which can make you life a lot easier, Improved Evasion at level 32 and Slippery Mind later if you only get save boosters, no mind immunity which will make your life easier (otherwise take Crippling Strike to make your sneaks do some disabling -STR). I took Epic Will and Epid Fortitude because his saves are in the ***hole. I don't dig the whole sneak-in-plate thing but you easily have enough skillpoints to go around if you want to. You can access darkness etc through scrolls but you can just stand there, KD and whack away. With your decent AB, you should get a few through and you'll be able to land sneaks.
A good sneaky-type in plate build with style that you might want to look at is GD's His Infernal Mistress - Rogue 5, Fighter 10, BG 25 _________________ .:\_/:. Only those who have known darkness in (OvO) their hearts will see the shadows in life... (|__|) ..".."..
Edited By Jennalee on 10/30/05 00:44
Well I think I hit upon the winner for my situation. LEt me point out that unless your server admin give's your 4 free feat's at creation, and a signifigant stat boost(+8) You cannot pull it off otherwise.
Yes, This is an illegal build for 90% of the world. However, it will be highly effective for where I'll be playing. To give you an idea, what he'll turn out as on that server at level 40 is screenshotted from my test module and linked at the bottom.
"If they live long enough get the opportunity to hit you back you are doing something wrong" ~The Justicar
Those items you can get are sickeningly strong lol... Where ya playing? _________________ .:\_/:. Only those who have known darkness in (OvO) their hearts will see the shadows in life... (|__|) ..".."..
Man, you are a munchkin!!!
Quote: Posted 10/30/05 03:56:34 (GMT) -- Jennalee
Those items you can get are sickeningly strong lol... Where ya playing?
69.166.153.37:5121
It require's a custom hak however, and they just a day or two ago had some trouble with the webpage.
EDIT:
Found the stuff on the web, Only hak needed is the one on the very top of the list ATM. http://www.gameroom.com/rolkrossfire/haks.html _________________ "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." ~George Orwell
