We are getting an influx of dragons on our server because they are so bl**dy hard to hit/kill... I hate cheese and I would love for rp purposes to be able to build a dragon slayer... I am thinking along the lines of a knight of the realm kind of character... prob wielding a bastard sword and shield... Any ideas how i can get the AB high enough to hit these high AC (80/90 odd) dragons reliably...? I have +8 weapons and +6 items (STR etc) at my disposal...
Well, the only things that are going to get raw AB up that high is an AA or a fighter/WM/rogue or bard.
You might want to consider a dragon shape build - AB can get into the mid 70's, but with lots of attacks if you take a monk level and you can pick the same color as the ones you are fighting for immunity to their breath weapons.
But the best choice is probably a near-pure spellcaster - AC doesn't help against IGMS, Ice Storm, Finger of Death, etc.
TM
Oh, I hadn't noticed now you're a mod now Kail, congratulations.
Well, I wouldn't want to see a dragon vs dragon, since dragons generally have high ACs around 90 with low ABs around 50 and high HPs around 900, so, long fight, even longer assuming probable de-shift and heal or regen.
With +8 items and +6 stats, I think an AA would have an AB around 70 or so... maybe more, a Paladin 10/ Bard 1/ AA 29 is powerful, use bard song, scrolls of cat's grace, aid, bless, and divine favor to buff AB and you should get to hit them.
High caster will kill dragons easily with empowered or maximized IGMS, true, a dragon's potential SR isn't so high, so you can beat it, this might be your best choice: some Palemaster levels to boost AC, since IGMS maxes out at caster level 20, and automatic still Spell III with full plate and tower shield, with +8 items you can get your AC to good terms and beat them easily.
IKD! As a medium sized creature it IS possible to Knock-down a Dragon...though there sky high disciplines make it difficult
If u wanna smash them in combat, u basically need the difference between your AB and AC to be less than theirs! That is, maximum AB for dragon is ~60 or so, so with AC ~90, you need an AB of 70+ with an AC of 75+...plus a means to lower their AC, wouldn't hurt -> taunt or curse song
I woudn't necessarily take an Archer to a dragon as they often have a few Monk levels to give a bit of extra speed, IKD & most importantly Wisdom AC, this means a non-speed Archer would be constantly hounded by the Dragon & frequently Knocked-down...
I know I haven't really suggested anything helpful !
Hmm...how about a 1/2 Orc Pally/RDD (if alignment changes not a problem), can end up with a Dev DC of 53, combined with an AB of 73 (30 bab, +23 str, +9 self-buffs, +8 weapon, +3 ewf), should be enough to hit a couple of times!
...or maybe a dual wield dex. Kama WM/monk...
Quote: Posted 04/12/06 07:19:51 (GMT) -- krsboss
If u wanna smash them in combat, u basically need the difference between your AB and AC to be less than theirs! That is, maximum AB for dragon is ~60 or so, so with AC ~90, you need an AB of 70+ with an AC of 75+...plus a means to lower their AC, wouldn't hurt -> taunt or curse song
Note that the Jormundgandr dragon build can get AB to ~75 (has all Cleric buffs, can reach the +20 cap for ~52 round duration). You will need an AC around 95, not 75.
Quote: I woudn't necessarily take an Archer to a dragon as they often have a few Monk levels to give a bit of extra speed, IKD & most importantly Wisdom AC, this means a non-speed Archer would be constantly hounded by the Dragon & frequently Knocked-down...
Archer could work, as long as you spam Called Shots: Leg. With 6 attacks per round (even if they have 3 monk levels for Deflect Arrow, you will have a chance at 5), you can drop their speed quite a bit. If you spot them at a distance and get in 3-4 called shots before they close with you, you will be able to play keep away effectively. If they get to you before you have time to do that, it will be over quickly (especially if the Dragon has the Disarm feat...).
TM
Quote: IKD! As a medium sized creature it IS possible to Knock-down a Dragon...though there sky high disciplines make it difficult
LOL.... ehm, you meant it as a joke right?
Let's consider, Dragon builds generally high defensive abilities, like immune to sneaks and stuffs, yeah, the Order of Jormungandr is the dragon that kills dragons... and everything else.
Dev Crit? but wait, druids have the spell Death Ward, lasts pretty decent, aren't they inmune to dev crit after that? let's say they don't use it, or they were dispelled (druid 14 dragons are easy to dispel) DC 53 would be hard for any dragon, a druid / monk / CoT dragon might resist it though. Your Dev Crit has a second problem here, your AB needs to make the cut, or a 20 roll won't make crit, and I'm not sure if you can get it.
Uh... trying with casters, here's my caster: Arcane Wall he has DR 21/- and a decent AC (use Improved Expertise all the time), just spam IGMS, Empowered IGMS and Maximized IGMS and hope his SR isn't too high (druid 14 dragons would get 26, any dragon has at least 20). If by chance you can beat his SR he's toast.
Dev Crit? but wait, druids have the spell Death Ward, lasts pretty decent, aren't they inmune to dev crit after that? let's say they don't use it,
I do not believe that Death Ward prevents a Dev Crit.
It does not on the server I play, and it has been ages since I played the original campeigne.
Death Ward does nothing to stop Dev Crit. _________________ Where I'm playing now: World of Greyhawk.
Oh well, good news.
STR based bards can work quite well too, as well as spell sword type builds with spells such as negative energy burst. Good str melee bards are 20/10/10 bard/pm or cot/rdd, and 26/4/10 bard/blackguard, fighter, or cot/RDD, the bard/rdd/pm can get very good defense too, as can the other examples depending on stats, items and whether you take div shield or not.
And remember; shifters MUST unshift back to their natural form before been able to restore their reduced stats and abilites, hence the reason bards, and negative energy burst mages are such great dragon killers.
Hmmm, STR reducing would work ok, but suppose a max buffed dragon can get STR to 60 with empowered Bull's STR, Extended AoV and Blood Frenzy, so as much as you lower it, you won't make him deal 0. The problem is, although it's a very good idea, that won't decrease his AC, which was what hads78 was saying.....
Quote: Any ideas how i can get the AB high enough to hit these high AC (80/90 odd) dragons reliably...?
Did he ignored this topic? he hasn't said anything.
!