Yes, I've been thinking about a Bard/ PM/ Wep M

A little odd in the way of class choices I understand, and feat starved, but...

I'd like at least 16 Bard for max song buff and damage, lvl 6 spells, and Curse Song. Lasting Inspiration would be nice too, but beggers can't be choosers, eh?

Now, for the Wep M levels... thinking 7, for the increased crit range and a bit higher AB.

If it's possible, I'd like Epic Mage Armor... from the PM feats I geuss?

Strength based, able to wear heavy armor. And for weapons... anything one handed will do, though Morning Star, Long sword, or Rapier would be nice.

I've already checked out some of the Bard/PM/ Wep M's posted, but didnt find any suitable. I did try to build one from scratch, but....
Quote: Posted 07/31/06 18:20:32 (GMT) -- Fiend knight

I've already checked out some of the Bard/PM/ Wep M's posted, but didnt find any suitable.

Eh, perhaps it would make it easier for us if we knew why, don't you think?
_________________
"With Europe liberated, the people of the world turned their attention to that old devil, the United States of America [...] We taught that monster of old the true meaning of freedom."
Star Wreck Well, the ones I saw didn't have enough Bard for the spells and song capabilities.
Quote: Posted 07/31/06 18:20:32 (GMT) -- Fiend knight

Yes, I've been thinking about a Bard/ PM/ Wep M

A little odd in the way of class choices I understand, and feat starved, but...

I'd like at least 16 Bard for max song buff and damage, lvl 6 spells, and Curse Song. Lasting Inspiration would be nice too, but beggers can't be choosers, eh?

Now, for the Wep M levels... thinking 7, for the increased crit range and a bit higher AB.

If it's possible, I'd like Epic Mage Armor... from the PM feats I geuss?

Strength based, able to wear heavy armor. And for weapons... anything one handed will do, though Morning Star, Long sword, or Rapier would be nice.

I've already checked out some of the Bard/PM/ Wep M's posted, but didnt find any suitable. I did try to build one from scratch, but....

LI apart it's possible to build it but the result ain't that good. I suggest dropping heavy armor: you can wear scale mail with Cat's Grace and a minor DEX item and lose only -1 AC. That leaves room for either Lingering Song or Still Spell; I'd chose the latter.


Bard(17), Pale Master(16), Weapon Master(7)
Human, any non lawful

STR: 14 (26)
DEX: 14
CON: 12
WIS: 8
INT: 14
CHA: 15 (16)

Hitpoints: 331
Skillpoints: 255
Saving Throws (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): 17/19/25
Saving Throw bonuses: Spells: +9
BAB: 26
AB (max, naked): 39 (melee), 29 (ranged)
AC (naked/mundane armor/shield only): 30/38
Spell Casting: Bard(6)


SKILLS
Concentration 43(44), Discipline 43(51), Intimidate 4(7), Open Lock 1(3), Perform 32(35), Search 1(3), Spellcraft 43(45), Tumble 40(42), UMD 42(45)


LEVELING GUIDE
01: Bard(1): Dodge, Weapon Proficiency Martial
02: Bard(2)
03: Bard(3): Weapon Focus
04: Bard(4): STR+1, (STR=15)
05: Bard(5)
06: Bard(6): Mobility
07: Bard(7)
08: Bard(8): STR+1, (STR=16)
09: Bard(9): Expertise
10: Bard(10)
11: Bard(11)
12: Bard(12): CHA+1, Spring Attack, (CHA=16)
13: Bard(13)
14: Bard(14)
15: Bard(15): Whirlwind Attack
16: Weapon Master(1): STR+1, Weapon of Choice, (STR=17)
17: Weapon Master(2)
18: Weapon Master(3): Still Spell
19: Weapon Master(4)
20: Weapon Master(5): STR+1, (STR=18)
21: Bard(16): Curse Song
22: Weapon Master(6)
23: Weapon Master(7)
24: Pale Master(1): STR+1, Epic Weapon Focus, (STR=19)
25: Pale Master(2)
26: Pale Master(3): {Darkvision}
27: Pale Master(4): Epic Prowess
28: Pale Master(5): STR+1, (STR=20)
29: Pale Master(6)
30: Pale Master(7): Great Strength I, (STR=21)
31: Pale Master(8)
32: Pale Master(9): STR+1, (STR=22)
33: Pale Master(10): Great Strength II, (STR=23)
34: Pale Master(11)
35: Pale Master(12)
36: Pale Master(13): STR+1, Great Strength III, Epic Energy Resistance: Acid I, (STR=25)
37: Pale Master(14)
38: Pale Master(15)
39: Pale Master(16): Epic Spell: Epic Mage Armor, Epic Spell: Epic Warding
40: Bard(17): STR+1, (STR=26)


Honestly, WM just hampers the build, it's a feat sink that kills it. You just get +1 AB and a higher multiplier but not a better crit range since you are so short on feats you can't get in IC (I'm assuming going with scimitar here) unless you drop still spell, which I wouldn't do. HPs are gonna be low too and AC will be lower than it could. Now think about going Bard 14/RDD 10/PM 16 (epic spells) or Bard 20/RDD 10/PM 10 (LI and better song). You end up with a better AB, better AC, better crit range, fire immunitiy, higher STR (therefore dmg), more HPs, all the feats you need and both wings and a bonearm... oh, ain't that nice?


Cheers,
Kail
_________________
To hear the sound of Freedom, many gave their lives
They fought for you and me
Those memories will always live inside us, and now it's our time to be free

Edited By Kail Pendragon on 07/31/06 20:29

Eheh... bear with me, I'm kind of noobish, and have trouble with anything other then a basic point-and-click weapon master

I thought the Wep Master would have given better crit range and way higher ab... was obviously worong. However, this Bard/RDD/PM thing... alot of people build that combo on the server I play on. I had been tihnking about it, but it sort of fell intot he background. I'll start trying to do one of those though. Thanks for the help. 7 levels of WM gives you all the threat range and crit range boosts. You get +1 AB from WM levels 5, 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, and 28. So in order to get the great AB, you need to take a lot of WM levels. If you want 10 PM and good Bard Song (i.e. at least 16 levels), that only leaves you 14 levels for WM, which means only +2 AB from the WM levels.
_________________
It's rogue, dammit, ROGUE!!!
Quote: I'd like at least 16 Bard for max song buff and damage, lvl 6 spells, and Curse Song. Lasting Inspiration would be nice too, but beggers can't be choosers, eh?

You need to be at least Bard level 20 (If I'm correct, or was it 21?) to take Lasting Inspiration, also, the max Bardsong is at level 30 and 100 Perform, impossible to reach with the other requirements.

Any information on where you play? Epic Mage Armor can be a very bad choice if there are +5 AC items or higher around. +5 items galore... in fact... I don't even think it's possible to not have all +5 ac items.... Have a look at these two builds:


Bard(20), Red Dragon Disciple(10), Pale Master(10)
Human, any non lawful, non good

STR: 16 (36)
DEX: 10
CON: 14 (16)
WIS: 8
INT: 14 (16)
CHA: 14 (16)

Hitpoints: 442
Skillpoints: 280
Saving Throws (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): 23/23/20
Saving Throw bonuses: Spells: +9
BAB: 25
AB (max, naked): 42 (melee), 26 (ranged)
AC (naked/mundane armor/shield only): 30/41
Spell Casting: Bard(6)


SKILLS
Concentration 42(45), Discipline 37(50), Lore 8(31), Perform 37(50), Spellcraft 42(45), Taunt 42(45), Tumble 40(40), UMD 32(35)


LEVELING GUIDE
01: Bard(1): Weapon Proficiency Martial, Armor Proficiency Heavy
02: Bard(2)
03: Bard(3): Still Spell
04: Bard(4): STR+1, (STR=17)
05: Bard(5)
06: Bard(6): Curse Song
07: Bard(7)
08: Red Dragon Disciple(1): STR+1, (STR=18)
09: Red Dragon Disciple(2): Extend Spell, (STR=20)
10: Red Dragon Disciple(3)
11: Red Dragon Disciple(4): (STR=22)
12: Bard(8): STR+1, Blind Fight, (STR=23)
13: Red Dragon Disciple(5)
14: Red Dragon Disciple(6)
15: Red Dragon Disciple(7): Toughness, (CON=16)
16: Red Dragon Disciple(8): STR+1, (STR=24)
17: Bard(9)
18: Bard(10): Weapon Focus
19: Bard(11)
20: Bard(12): STR+1, (STR=25)
21: Red Dragon Disciple(9): Epic Weapon Focus, (INT=16)
22: Red Dragon Disciple(10): {Darkvision}, (STR=29), (CHA=16)
23: Bard(13)
24: Bard(14): STR+1, Armor Skin, (STR=30)
25: Bard(15)
26: Bard(16)
27: Bard(17): Epic Skill Focus: Perform
28: Pale Master(1): STR+1, (STR=31)
29: Pale Master(2)
30: Pale Master(3): Epic Prowess
31: Pale Master(4)
32: Bard(18): STR+1, (STR=32)
33: Pale Master(5): Great Strength I, (STR=33)
34: Pale Master(6)
35: Pale Master(7)
36: Pale Master(8): STR+1, Great Strength II, (STR=35)
37: Bard(19)
38: Pale Master(9)
39: Bard(20): Lasting Inspiration
40: Pale Master(10): STR+1, (STR=36)


********************


Bard(14), Red Dragon Disciple(10), Pale Master(16)
Human, any non lawful, non good

STR: 16 (36)
DEX: 10
CON: 14 (16)
WIS: 8
INT: 14 (16)
CHA: 14 (16)

Hitpoints: 447
Skillpoints: 268
Saving Throws (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): 23/23/20
BAB: 25
AB (max, naked): 42 (melee), 26 (ranged)
AC (naked/mundane armor/shield only): 34/45
Spell Casting: Bard(5)


SKILLS
Concentration 40(43), Discipline 43(56), Lore 8(25), Open Lock 1(1), Perform 18(21), Spellcraft 42(45), Taunt 43(46), Tumble 40(40), UMD 32(35)


LEVELING GUIDE
01: Bard(1): Lingering Song, Weapon Proficiency Martial
02: Bard(2)
03: Bard(3): Weapon Focus
04: Bard(4): STR+1, (STR=17)
05: Bard(5)
06: Red Dragon Disciple(1): Blind Fight
07: Red Dragon Disciple(2): (STR=19)
08: Red Dragon Disciple(3): STR+1, (STR=20)
09: Red Dragon Disciple(4): Armor Proficiency Heavy, (STR=22)
10: Red Dragon Disciple(5)
11: Red Dragon Disciple(6)
12: Red Dragon Disciple(7): STR+1, Knockdown, (STR=23), (CON=16)
13: Red Dragon Disciple(8)
14: Bard(6)
15: Bard(7): Curse Song
16: Bard(8): STR+1, (STR=24)
17: Bard(9)
18: Bard(10): Still Spell
19: Bard(11)
20: Bard(12): STR+1, (STR=25)
21: Red Dragon Disciple(9): Epic Weapon Focus, (INT=16)
22: Red Dragon Disciple(10): RDD: (Darkvision), (STR=29), (CHA=16)
23: Pale Master(1)
24: Pale Master(2): STR+1, Armor Skin, (STR=30)
25: Pale Master(3)
26: Pale Master(4)
27: Pale Master(5): Epic Prowess
28: Bard(13): STR+1, (STR=31)
29: Pale Master(6)
30: Pale Master(7): Toughness
31: Pale Master(8)
32: Pale Master(9): STR+1, (STR=32)
33: Pale Master(10): Great Strength I, (STR=33)
34: Pale Master(11)
35: Pale Master(12)
36: Pale Master(13): STR+1, Great Strength II, Epic Energy Resistance: Acid I, (STR=35)
37: Pale Master(14)
38: Pale Master(15)
39: Pale Master(16): Epic Spell: Epic Warding, Epic Spell: Epic Mage Armor
40: Bard(14): STR+1, (STR=36)


Cheers,
Kail
_________________
Heavy metal
Or no metal at all
Whimps and posers
Leave the hall!