I want to do a Barbarian/Fighter something along the lines of Anuis' "Wrathful Berserker" posted here. My problem is that my PW makes you take at least 3 levels in your first class before taking a second class. I don't know how taking the first 3 levels as fighter (as opposed to the first 2 as per Anuis' guide) would effect the overall integrity of the build. I know that you have to take certain classes at certain levels and all that mumbo jumbo I don't understand. Could I just take an extra level of fighter at 3 and drop one of the other levels of fighter out later in the build -- which begs the question, at which point should I drop a level of fighter? At 20, 21, 24 or 25?
That shouldnt affect anything at all. Just forget about the level of Fighter at level 10 and put it at level 3. You can still follow everything exactly as is beyond that point, if you want to.
Quote: Posted 08/23/09 01:37 (GMT) -- sbogill
I want to do a Barbarian/Fighter something along the lines of Anuis' "Wrathful Berserker" posted here. My problem is that my PW makes you take at least 3 levels in your first class before taking a second class. I don't know how taking the first 3 levels as fighter (as opposed to the first 2 as per Anuis' guide) would effect the overall integrity of the build.
At lv 3, we get a feat regardless of class, so ignore cleave for a sec. What do you notice about level 3 and 10?
*waits eagerly for the correct answer to materialize from the ether*
THEY ARE THE SAME! In this case, fighter and barbarian are interchangable in EVERY way. The nice thing about the bioware builds is they lay it out for you in every way. THere is no guessing at all.
Quote: Could I just take an extra level of fighter at 3 and drop one of the other levels of fighter out later in the build -- which begs the question, at which point should I drop a level of fighter? At 20, 21, 24 or 25?
k, i have no idea what you mean by dropping a fighter level, and why would you drop an epic one?
Quote: I know that you have to take certain classes at certain levels and all that mumbo jumbo I don't understand.
k. BASIC nwn building: there are only 2 reasons to take a class 1) to gain a feat or 2) to gain skill set. That is it. The mystery to character building is that simple. I wish it was more, but it really isnt.
Skill basics: at lv 1 you start with 4 pts you can put to any one skill to max that skill for the level. Make sense? That means, at lv 2, you max a skill at 5! Most, if not all skills, gain benefit at multiples of 5, and give nothing for more or less than the multiple (tumble for example, gives no more benefit for 41 vs 40). SO, when you are using Rogue or Bard, for example, for Tumble dumps, in order to get the best bang for your buck, it makes the most sense to add these at lvls where tumble will be multiples of 5. So, you will see rogue at lv 7, 12, 17, 22, etc, or lvl +3.
Feat choice is more complex and really is determined by 1) your play style, 2) what the build is going to accomplish, 3) the pw, etc. It isnt as easy to have set rules cuz i have played many a cleric with pure caster lvls at 24 and only able to cast lv 6 spells (meaning my base wisdom is 16) because i was going for another feat before finishing casting. ( Under the PRC section in ECB you can read my hospi/heiro/cleric build to see what i mean. ) I am certain that others would make sure they have 19 wisdom before going for the feat. THat is all i mean.
What makes Anuis, Grizz, Kail, and Mith such extraordinary builders is that they seem to have unique ways to approach the feat side of things. It is here that the artistry and the true genius is found. Skills are generally easy.
I hope that helps you. I noticed you have been here since 2004, which means that maybe, we didnt do such a hot job in setting up nwn building basics.. _________________
Quote: Posted 06/23/04 21:16 (GMT) -- Anuis
Suolucider, Blitz 04, avado, Quisition, Boourns, ... welcome to the guild! Anuis
Makes me feel OOLD!!
Quote: I know that you have to take certain classes at certain levels and all that mumbo jumbo I don't understand.
Aside from what avado said, the mumbo jumbo normally it's just round up BAB (Fighter and Barbarian are both high BAB classes so there's no problem) or increased playability by taking the strong stuff fast, that's it. _________________ "My name is Thaxll'ssyllia, but you simians may refer to me merely as "Sir", if you prefer a less... syllable intensive workout."
Edwin Odesseiron - Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn
Edited By Thaxll'ssyllia on 08/23/09 15:58
Quote: I noticed you have been here since 2004, which means that maybe, we didnt do such a hot job in setting up nwn building basics..
Nah, it's all good. I registered on this site back in '04 the first time I played through KoTOR for Xbox. I just started playing NWN a couple weeks ago. Basically, I just got through the original campaign and am looking to land on a decent PW that's still active.
Going to chime in a bit..
Overall, there should not be much of a difference if you exchange the level 3 with fighter instead of barbarian.
However, you will miss the fast movement and rage that you get from first level of barbarian. It's quite nice to have more strength at early levels from using rages. +4 to strength and con ain't too shabby.
Anyway, you will be delayed just until level 4 which is not a big deal.
There are also some feats you can change around without any problem, for example, I would exchange Weapon Focus with Great Cleave and take Great Cleave in place of Weapon Focus. Unless you have mobs which Great Cleave probably would be more ideal to be taken earlier.
Anuis _________________ - Epic Character Builders Guild
- Life is but a dream...
- I know more than I am letting on...
-I think, Therefore I am.
I'm probably missing something obvious...
...but why not drop starting dex to 14, con to 16, and put all points into str? Then take Great Str I and Epic Weapon Focus at level 21, delay Epic Weapon Specialization to 24 (drop improved power attack) and wind up with 30 str?
Edit: Actually, the level 24 feat ain't a fighter bonus feat, so you could take Great Str I at that point and still get epic focus/epic specialization at level 21.
Also, why is there more than 13 dex in the build if you're using full plate?
Further edit: looking at the epic levels overall...this seems to be better...
That should give you 16 + 10 + 6 = 32 final str at the cost of Thundering Rage and Epic Toughness 1.
Edited By Magical Master on 08/24/09 02:11
No idea, I'd definitely drop some WIS and DEX for CON, STR or even INT, delay Epic Weapon Specialization for Great Strength I, drop Improved Power Attack in its place and fill with another Great Strength instead of Epic Toughness. I'm pretty certain none of the feats taken there require 15 DEX.
Edit: Well heck you edited while I was writing. _________________ "My name is Thaxll'ssyllia, but you simians may refer to me merely as "Sir", if you prefer a less... syllable intensive workout."
Edwin Odesseiron - Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn
...but why not drop starting dex to 14, con to 16, and put all points into str? Then take Great Str I and Epic Weapon Focus at level 21, delay Epic Weapon Specialization to 24 (drop improved power attack) and wind up with 30 str?
I am not sure, I posted that build so long time ago... but I am pretty sure they posted the wrong version since the one on there has four skills whereas it only has two skills, discipline and taunt.
I believe I sent them the correction but they never updated it.
Quote: Also, why is there more than 13 dex in the build if you're using full plate?
Same as above. But I think in case of Dex, I believe I planned to get some feat that required 15 Dex, but I can't recall at the moment. Again, it's old build.
No idea, I'd definitely drop some WIS and DEX for CON, STR or even INT, delay Epic Weapon Specialization for Great Strength I, drop Improved Power Attack in its place and fill with another Great Strength instead of Epic Toughness. I'm pretty certain none of the feats taken there require 15 DEX.
Edit: Well heck you edited while I was writing.
I wouldn't drop WIS, well technically it does nothing but it does keep the Will save from being reduced by 1. His will saves is pitiful yes, so he needs any he can get, even from his abilities. His rage at early levels only gives you +2 but only will be gaining benefit of +1 due to negative Wisdom modifier if you went that way. If you don't mind that, then that change would work.
Anuis _________________ - Epic Character Builders Guild
- Life is but a dream...
- I know more than I am letting on...
-I think, Therefore I am.
Pssssh, to the saves. Being blind like I was when posting my viking berserker. Drop Wis by 2 points, Dex down to 13.
Most other stuff has been mentioned. But Take CoT in place of you last 4 fighter levels to help your will save (actually, all saves) a little at no cost at all. _________________ We are sons of Odin, and the fire that we burn inside is the legacy of warrior-kings who reign above in the sky I will lead the charge, my sword into the wind Sons of Odin fights to die and live again
Quote: Posted 08/24/09 03:44 (GMT) -- Anuis
I am not sure, I posted that build so long time ago... but I am pretty sure they posted the wrong version since the one on there has four skills whereas it only has two skills, discipline and taunt.
What do you mean? I actually think the version posted has skillpoints to spare. Even with 8 INT, it would get 4 points pr lvl of Barbarian and 2 with fighter.
As it stands it has
8x3=24 skillpoints from fighter 20 skillpints on lvl 1 31x5=155 skillpoints from Barb total 199.
Enough to max out 4 skills (43x4=172) and have 27 left.
That's enough to max out essentials Disc, Taunt and tumble. And even help your saves vs spells a litte too. _________________ We are sons of Odin, and the fire that we burn inside is the legacy of warrior-kings who reign above in the sky I will lead the charge, my sword into the wind Sons of Odin fights to die and live again
Quote: Posted 10/04/09 15:34 (GMT) -- Grimnir77
Quote: Posted 08/24/09 03:44 (GMT) -- Anuis
I am not sure, I posted that build so long time ago... but I am pretty sure they posted the wrong version since the one on there has four skills whereas it only has two skills, discipline and taunt.
What do you mean? I actually think the version posted has skillpoints to spare. Even with 8 INT, it would get 4 points pr lvl of Barbarian and 2 with fighter.
As it stands it has
8x3=24 skillpoints from fighter 20 skillpints on lvl 1 31x5=155 skillpoints from Barb total 199.
Enough to max out 4 skills (43x4=172) and have 27 left.
That's enough to max out essentials Disc, Taunt and tumble. And even help your saves vs spells a litte too.
Like I said.. it was long time ago.. I can't remember anything much anymore... heh.
I have too many notes on many builds... some with same names and such. I think one of the version I had only had two skill sets. Whereas the one you mentioned has four...
*sigh* Again, I don't remember anything anymore. I blame it on too much fumes from welding and lack of sleep. I am actually considering change in career to something else.
Anuis _________________ - Epic Character Builders Guild
+4 to strength and con ain't too shabby. 
